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View Diary: While We Are Subjected To Kabuki Theater The Country Continues March Towards Authoritarianism (104 comments)

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  •  Can we agree to stop saying "kabuki?" (16+ / 0-)

    It's getting a tad overused at this point.

    Look, I understand your point. There are a lot of Dems who didn't/don't do a great job of oversight on domestic surveillance. There is too much money in politics, etc.

    It would be great if we had a parliamentary system where we could vote any number of other parties, but we don't. We need to live in the real world.

    Republicans gave us Citizens United, multiple wars, a financial collapse, the Tea Party shutdown etc etc.

    I'm not willing to see how many thousands of people are going to literally die if they take over all three branches of government again.

    Maybe it's an exercise some people are willing to engage in, but I'm not. Gore wasn't a great candidate in 2000. But the hundreds of thousands of people who are dead because of 2 terms of Bush probably would vehemently disagree that Democrats vs Republicans is just Kabuki theater.

    When we stop putting leaders from the past up on pedestals and ignoring their flaws, we can start seeing our present leaders for what they really are.

    by PhillyJeff on Tue Oct 15, 2013 at 11:40:27 PM PDT

    •  I feel like I'm getting bukakked by kabuki (nt) (5+ / 0-)

      warning: snark above

      by NE2 on Tue Oct 15, 2013 at 11:47:23 PM PDT

      [ Parent ]

      •  Do you have anything to say about the content (3+ / 0-)

        of the diary?  Any refutation?  Any counter-point?

      •  However (0+ / 0-)

        Kabuki Theatre of the Absurd is pretty good. Rhinoceros would be particularly good done in full press Japanese costume and apropos as well.

        Everyone in town has succumbed to rhinoceritis save for Berenger, Dudard and Daisy. Berenger is locked up in his apartment, yelling at the rhinos that rush by for having destroyed civilization until Dudard arrives to check on him. Dudard trivializes the transformations by saying that people have the right to choose what they do, even transform; but Berenger insists that the transformations couldn't be voluntary since his friend Jean had initially hated the rhinos and that he was probably brainwashed. Dudard counterargues that people can change their minds and gradually grows more accepting until he concludes that he must "follow [his] peers and [his] leaders" before departing and turning into a rhino.

        “The universe implodes. No matter.” -Liam Williams

        by northsylvania on Wed Oct 16, 2013 at 02:21:47 AM PDT

        [ Parent ]

      •  LOL (0+ / 0-)

        exceedingly well played

        Please don't dominate the rap, Jack, if you got nothin' new to say - Grateful Dead

        by Cedwyn on Wed Oct 16, 2013 at 04:33:48 AM PDT

        [ Parent ]

      •  Uprated for the well-turned phrase. n/t (0+ / 0-)

        "Politeness is wasted on the dishonest, who will always take advantage of any well-intended concession." - Barrett Brown

        by 3rdOption on Wed Oct 16, 2013 at 07:45:19 AM PDT

        [ Parent ]

    •  Have you calculated how many thousands of (15+ / 0-)

      people have died as a result of the latest "austerity" measures imposed in 2011?

      You know what's really tiresome?  The setting up of these issues in an hyper-partisan manner.

      The "Yeah, we have some problems on our side, but the other guys are much, much worst."

      What does that means, anyways?

      And in any case, am I advocating voting for the outright fascist Republicans?

      Can we just stick to the truth?  Can we call a spade by its proper name?

      If the president orders the assassination of an innocent teenager, an American citizen, extra-judicially, am I supposed to look the other way because he happens to have a "D" beside his name?

      Yes, it is true that objectively, one can say that the Democratic party establishment is better than the Republican party establishment, by a long shot.

      But does that mean that we don't address wrongdoing, and injustices committed by functionaries in our Party?

      I would like to think that one should be able to chew gum and walk at the same time.

      •  A case in point currently on The Front Page (5+ / 0-)
        Recommended by:
        Chi, caul, kharma, 3rdOption, jeff in nyc

        Meteor Blades is highlighting this essay , by Cora Currier at ProPublica, in "Open Thread for Night Owls.

      •  And why did those happen? (3+ / 0-)
        Have you calculated how many thousands of people have died as a result of the latest "austerity" measures imposed in 2011?
        The austerity measures were justified by the large federal budget deficit—a deficit created by the Bush administration who inherited a surplus and pissed it away on tax cuts and foreign wars.

        Politics in America is often a choice between "meh" and "ugh," but that's how life works sometimes. That still doesn't mean that the choice isn't a real one, or that "ugh" isn't still worse than "meh," or that "ugh" won't produce a great deal more human suffering than "meh."

        Tell the parents whose kids were sent home from Head Start that the shutdown was "kabuki theater." Tell the mothers who are staring down a loss of WIC benefits, tell the beneficiaries of food banks that have had to shut down or cut back, tell the domestic violence survivors whose shelters are losing funding due to the shutdown that this is all "kabuki theater." It's not.

        Democrats stand for something, and Republicans stand for something else. The Democrats may not be the best representatives of our interests on the left, but unless you've got evidence that there's another viable political party out there that can represent our interests more effectively, they're what we've got in this system and we're going to have to work within that context.

        "When I give food to the poor, they call me a saint. When I ask why the poor have no food, they call me a communist." --Dom Helder Camara, archbishop of Recife

        by JamesGG on Wed Oct 16, 2013 at 04:32:41 AM PDT

        [ Parent ]

      •  that doesn't address PhillyJeff's point at all (7+ / 0-)

        If you think that the phrase "Kabuki Theater" is "call[ing] a spade by its proper name," the question arises: Why?

        In kabuki theater, the outcome is predetermined and known to all the performers in advance (and usually, but not necessarily, to the audience), although there is considerable scope for improvisation on details. And, of course, the outcome is theatrical.

        Describing a political conflict as "kabuki" seems to imply, at minimum, that the outcome is predetermined and/or irrelevant. It could mean, further, that the real outcome is to distract people from other events: our political leaders are like street urchins who fake a fight while they're picking our pockets. Or maybe it doesn't mean much more than "sux," in which case your reference to extra-judicial assassinations doesn't seem quite so wildly off-topic. Perhaps it is an equivocation with no specific meaning.

        "I am not sure how we got here, but then, I am not really sure where we are." -Susan from 29

        by HudsonValleyMark on Wed Oct 16, 2013 at 04:35:09 AM PDT

        [ Parent ]

      •  I would venture to guess that more people were (0+ / 0-)

        killed in 9/11, Iraq and Afghanistan than died as a result of austerity since 2011. I really, really hope you're not arguing that Obama has caused as much/more death than George W. Bush.

        I would like to think that one should be able to chew gum and walk at the same time.
        Unfortunately you're missing the whole point of the "Kabuki" argument.

        For the most part, the person invoking "Kabuki" is claiming that to a greater or smaller extent both parties are the same and whether Dems or Reps are elected, we're going to get the same Authoritarian/Corporatist/Warmongering etc government.

        My point is that Democrats may not be perfect, as Gore wasn't, but things become objectively much worse when Republicans take power.

        It would be great to live in an imaginary world where we don't have to choose the lesser of 2 evils, or where we'd have a perfectly progressive Democratic party.

        Until that happens we can only pressure our elected officials to move left and work hard to elect Democrats (or theoretically Republicans if progressive examples existed, which isn't the case in reality).

        If you're not willing to do that, or if you think the Dems are just as bad and/or voting isn't important and/or it's better to get rid of impure Democrats and let Republicans take over that's fine. If you're willing to accept "collateral damage" to accomplish that I respect that view as well.

        But those holding that view should at least be honest and admit real people might have to die and probably will have to die as a result.

        When we stop putting leaders from the past up on pedestals and ignoring their flaws, we can start seeing our present leaders for what they really are.

        by PhillyJeff on Wed Oct 16, 2013 at 07:54:54 AM PDT

        [ Parent ]

    •  Let's negotiate: (6+ / 0-)

      I agree to castigate anyone who uses "kabuki" if you agree to do the same to anyone who uses the phrase:

      Please proceed...

      In fact, I am SO FUCKING SICK of that phrase, I'll do two "kabuki" users to your one.

      So, how about it?

      Somebody has to do something, and it's just incredibly pathetic that it has to be us. ~ J. Garcia

      by DeadHead on Wed Oct 16, 2013 at 12:55:10 AM PDT

      [ Parent ]

      •  Please proceed governor . . . (0+ / 0-)

        Sorry, couldn't help myself! :(

        When we stop putting leaders from the past up on pedestals and ignoring their flaws, we can start seeing our present leaders for what they really are.

        by PhillyJeff on Wed Oct 16, 2013 at 07:55:45 AM PDT

        [ Parent ]

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