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View Diary: Bill Maher's excellent argument for a living wage (63 comments)

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  •  My choices are socialism or being a Republican? (2+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    Sparhawk, VClib
    There, I said it. I am officially a socialist. I value the needs of the many over the dreams of a few. If someone feels differently, become a Republican.
    If someone is believes in regulated capitalism instead of socialism, they can't be a Democrat?
    •  Regulated capitalism + social welfare IS socialism (9+ / 0-)

      Specifically, social democracy. Our culture has gotten hung up on terms and labels based on fear of a word. You literally can't be a Democrat without believing in some form of socialism. Hell, you used to not be able to be a Republican without believing in it too. It's not a dirty word.

      "Reagan's dead, and he was a lousy president" -- Keith Olbermann 4/22/09

      by kovie on Sat Oct 26, 2013 at 09:31:11 AM PDT

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      •  No it is not. Your comment indiciated (2+ / 0-)
        Recommended by:
        Sparhawk, VClib

        that you think it is  wrong for a small business owner to make money, at least in part, by making a profit off the work of others.  That's a rejection of one of the fundamental principles of capitalism.  You can't own a business (other than a sole proprietorship) without making a profit from the work of employees.  It doesn't make any economic sense to hire another employee if you aren't going to make a profit from their work for your business.  That's why a business, in a capitalist system, hires people -- because it can make money from their work.  

        Whether they are "exploited" is completely a matter of opinion, and has to be based on what that employee is worth in the market (at least in a capitalist system). Paying a highly skilled engineer $10 an hour to perform his engineering work might be "exploiting" him because his time is worth far, far, far more in the market  (and of course, because he's very marketable right now, he can get someone else to pay him far more and wouldn't work for that pay unless there were some other value that he saw in that job).  Paying a non-skilled worker without a high school diploma that same $10 an hour might not be "exploiting" him, assuming you are complying with labor laws.

        A socialist approach would tend to reject the notion that their "worth" is set by the value of their skills in the market.  

        •  No, it's not a matter of opinion (0+ / 0-)

          Today's minimum wage is exploitation, profits subsidized by your employees and government, which usually has to supplement their income with benefits. If you can't make a decent profit by paying living wages, then you're not a good businessperson and should get a real job like everyone else.

          Spare me the "free market"-based determination of prices and wages hooey.

          They're all fixed--by owners, not workers.

          Btw, I have relatives who successfully ran business by paying their employees living wages, plus benefits, didn't have to work them off the clock, and treated them fairly. So don't talk to me about those poor small businesspeople with the greedy employees that want to live on more than cat food. It's bullshit.

          No economy can or deserves to exist without socialist elements.

          "Reagan's dead, and he was a lousy president" -- Keith Olbermann 4/22/09

          by kovie on Sat Oct 26, 2013 at 02:27:37 PM PDT

          [ Parent ]

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