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View Diary: Chilling Effects: NSA Surveillance Drives U.S. Writers to Self-Censor (13 comments)

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  •  Hardly a new level. (3+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    quill, lysias, koNko
    However, current situation and revelations about wide scope of the Government agencies surveillance over the people around the world and in US certainly elevates the level of censorship to a completely new level.
    Take a look at the Soviet system, or the east German Stasi.
    China under Mao. North Korea under just about everybody since the 1910 annexation.

    ...and yet the West was under the impression that it had somehow " won" the Cold War, when it just took us a few years longer to lose...

    •  our new examples Soviet Union East Germany & China (1+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      quill

      I am sure you can extend this list to Nazi Germany, Chili during Pinochet, Cuba...  So that's it? That is what we now settle for? First criticized these regimes and now we adopting their principals?
      It is interesting how much noise it made about universal healthcare that it is a step to the Socialism. However, adopting direct tactics of spying on the citizens typical of authoritarian communist, socialist and other "ist" regimes does not scare Americans or media for that matter.

      •  I pointed out that, IMHO, both sides lost (0+ / 0-)

        the Cold War.

        So that's it? That is what we now settle for? First criticized these regimes and now we adopting their principals?
        You used the phrase
        completely new level.
        I pointed out that it's NOT new, by a long shot, and has in fact occurred in many places at many times. I can't quite grasp the logic that says an observation of fact is an expression of support.
        However, adopting direct tactics of spying on the citizens typical of authoritarian communist, socialist and other "ist" regimes does not scare Americans or media for that matter.
        Typical of authoritarian regimes, sure... hardly typical of either socialism ( Is Portugal a big survieller?) or Communism ( Was Mozambique a police state?).

        Americans, or at least an awful large contingent thereof, LIKE authoritarians. Not saying that's a good thing, just that it is.

        Hence, not so much outcry.

        •  Technologically, it IS a new level (1+ / 0-)
          Recommended by:
          lysias

          and the new technology has made global surveillance -- the collection of every electron passing through the fiber-optic cables -- not only a possibility but  a reality.

          These are aspects of the writing in this piece that could bear review, but I think the author is not off the mark to point out that a new level' of surveillance -- and thus of self-censorship -- has been reached.

          •  Self-censorship was worse in classic (0+ / 0-)

            totalitarian states, because not only was there a lot of government snooping, but dire punishment was all too likely if you were discovered saying something the government didn't like.  We still don't have the second condition here.  But it could be coming to us too at any time.

            The influence of the [executive] has increased, is increasing, and ought to be diminished.

            by lysias on Wed Nov 13, 2013 at 01:05:31 PM PST

            [ Parent ]

        •  I thought I was very specific talking -US only (0+ / 0-)

          In original post I did not compare current NSA with any other country so I thought it was pretty obvious I was talking about US only. Yes, Edger Hoover had files on many people and spied on many people, but nowhere close to a current scope. I am sure that he is rolling all jealous in his grave. As another commenter correctly noted it is totally new level both technologically and in its scope for any country. No one is naive that surveillance and spying were present are present and will be present at least for foreseeable future. However, it wiretapping that as you might know started during prohibition era has always had to be approved by the court and NEVER was so blanked.
          I do not think that any further nitpicking is required or will bear any meaningful fruit. It is obvious that you,  Remembering Jello, is not bothered by Big Brother looking after you. Since you mentioned Soviet system (I assume you meant NKVD or KGB) you should be familiar to what it led to -- Gulag and millions of innocent people killed. Perhaps when it will come to this point in this country you might change your mind or perhaps it might be too late if you will fall a victim to you tolerance.
          I hope that it will not come to this point, but just in case watch a great movie Enemy of the State. Enjoy!

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