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View Diary: My touchy Controversial Immigration Issues just won`t go away (21 comments)

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  •  She wasn't _allowed_ to work? (0+ / 0-)

    I may have missed that part.  When you said "unable to get work to pay her rent," did you mean that was because she had no visa?  Do they not have any off-the-books work in Spain?  Not even manual labor of the dishwashing or field-work sort?

    Moreover, and more importantly:  do you agree with the treatment your friend received in Spain?  Because it sounds like you think it was pretty terrible.

    •  She had a temp visa that ran out (0+ / 0-)

      Yes, she was not allowed to work.  She went over as a student, to study abroad.  She liked it there, and wanted to stay. She was working to pay her bills, but then when her visa ran out, she lost her job.  Yes, she was unable to work legally.

      Now could she have taken on demeaing illegal labor jobs for menial pay, and stayed illegally?  She probably could have, but she had more self-respect than that.

      It doesn't matter if I agree, it's their country, their laws.  Their laws say that if a person doesn't have a work visa, they can't work in Spain and take a job from a Spainard.  She had to give her job up to someone born in Spain, and go home.

      My point is that if it's okay for Spain to treat an American that way, and favor their native born, why isn't it okay for America to do the same?

      Was it terrible treatment?  Not really.  I don't favor economic mercinaries who hop the globe looking for work.  People need to build up industries and economies where they are.

      •  It matters a great deal if you agree. (0+ / 0-)

        Because you're arguing "if it's okay for Spain to do that," but it sounds like you really don't think it's okay.  You seem, in fact, to be pretty indignant about your friend's treatment -- so indignant that you're expressing it as her being "forced to leave," when in fact it sounds like it was her own economic situation plus her unwillingness to take a "degrading" menial job that forced her to leave.  (A decision I notice that you characterize as "more self-respect than that" rather than oh, I don't know, "more respect for the law than that.")

        So the answer to "why isn't it okay for America to do that?" is pretty obvious: because it isn't okay.  Because it's a crappy law that hurts people.

        "Deport yourself, or be destitute and starve to death"?  Why on earth would we want to imitate that kind of a law?

        •  Because we can't take in 7 billion people (0+ / 0-)

          The line has to be drawn somewhere, or everyone in America will become just as poor and destitute as everyone trying to come here.

          I bet you think that clean drinking water is a human right, correct?  Well do you think there will be any clean water with billions crowding in, looking for oportunity?

          There are physical limits to how many people this country can support. The line has to be drawn somewhere, that's why we have a legal immigration process.  And those who don't get in line don't get in.

          Are you willing to give up your land, your food, and your water?

          •  See, those are much more direct arguments (0+ / 0-)

            than "we should do this because that's what Spain does."  I don't know why you brought up the whole Spain thing to begin with.  Unless what you were trying to do was establish some sort of moral equivalence, as though that justifies anything.

            If insufficient clean water is a problem, we need better water purification techniques and better water-saving practices.  If insufficient land is a problem, we need to start using our land more efficiently.  If insufficient food is a problem ... no, let's get real, insufficient food is not a problem.

            I can't defend a policy of "we've got ours, tough luck for everybody else who needs some of it."  Especially considering how we got ours in the first place: by invading and conquering, or later by, well, immigrating.

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