Skip to main content

View Diary: Good WaPo editorial on "Keep Your Own Doctor" (153 comments)

Comment Preferences

  •  If people are so insistent on being able (11+ / 0-)

    to see "their doctor," in other words, the patient should have the choice to receive the service from the providers they prefer (which, in principle, I agree with)

    then they should really be pushing for a more universal/socialized/single-payer health care system.

    Funny how those are not the type of people complaining about "keeping their own doctor."

    "In a country well governed, poverty is something to be ashamed of. In a country badly governed, wealth is something to be ashamed of.” -Confucius

    by pierre9045 on Thu Dec 26, 2013 at 08:11:40 AM PST

    •  Catchment (2+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      ladybug53, historys mysteries

      My experience is only in the UK, but there you choose a doctor assigned to your catchment area.  You can't just pick any doctor anywhere.

      I'm still mad about Nixon.

      by J Orygun on Fri Dec 27, 2013 at 02:14:50 AM PST

      [ Parent ]

    •  Here's what Obama said on June 15, 2009 (1+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      methylin
      So let me begin by saying this: I know that there are millions of Americans who are content with their health care coverage – they like their plan and they value their relationship with their doctor. And that means that no matter how we reform health care, we will keep this promise: If you like your doctor, you will be able to keep your doctor. Period. If you like your health care plan, you will be able to keep your health care plan. Period. No one will take it away. No matter what.
      That's about as unambiguous and absolute promise as you are ever likely to get.

      And obviously he did not keep that promise.

      Everything in the Washington Post editorial is obviously true.  So was Obama deliberately lying in 2009 or was the administration really incompetent enough to believe what he was saying?

      •  you should be smart enough to understand (3+ / 0-)

        that this wasn't obama's promise to keep.  he didn't force anyone to get rid of their coverage - it was the fact they had shitty policies to begin with, that would not hold up with the law, that meant they had to get new policies.  the insurance co's could always stop offering plans - this they could do before obama care as wella s afterwards.

        •  These insurance plans were canceled because the (3+ / 0-)

          ACA required it. So yes, he did force those people with the junk insurance plans to "get rid" of their coverage.

          It doesn't matter whether the plans were junk or not, or why the law required them to be canceled - he made the promise with no exceptions, not a single one, and it was his promise to keep, because the ACA is his law.

          •  Insurance companies, not ACA (4+ / 0-)

            The ACA specifically allowed insurance companies to keep offering their pre-ACA plans forever, so any claim that the ACA took anyone's insurance away is a lie (and several insurance companies that claimed it lost in court, so it's not just my opinion, it's a fact of law). If the insurance company chooses to cancel the plan anyway, that's up to them - the ACA quite clearly didn't force insurance carriers to continue plans that they wanted to cancel.

            That being said, Obama should have added the caveat in that speech that while the ACA won't take anyone's pre-ACA insurance plan away, their insurance carrier can, because insurance carriers cancel 40-70% of all plans every year. That caveat was in the documentation of the ACA, and was well understood by everyone analyzing the ACA at the time, but the fact that the details were in the documentation but not in the speech is being used to attack Obama. He should have anticipated that line of attack and kept the important limitation (the ACA won't take away your insurance company, but your carrier might) in the speech even though it's not as clean a line to deliver.

            •  Now this is a fascinating claim (2+ / 1-)
              Recommended by:
              nextstep, divineorder
              Hidden by:
              mikeVA
              so any claim that the ACA took anyone's insurance away is a lie (and several insurance companies that claimed it lost in court, so it's not just my opinion, it's a fact of law).
              I frankly think it's a load of bullshit - there has not been enough time for any such case to go to court and get a final ruling - but I could be wrong.

              Can you provide a cite?

              I seriously doubt it.

            •  This is also a general load of nonsense (2+ / 0-)
              Recommended by:
              nextstep, divineorder
              The ACA specifically allowed insurance companies to keep offering their pre-ACA plans forever, so any claim that the ACA took anyone's insurance away is a lie
              Mind explaining then what this was for?
              President Obama relented to pressure from the public and his own party Thursday and changed one of the bedrock requirements of the new health-care law to fulfill his promise to allow people to keep their insurance plans if they want.

              ...

              “There have been times where I thought we were . . . slapped around a little bit unjustly. This one’s deserved, all right? It’s on us,” Obama said regarding the policy cancellation issue, which contradicted his repeated promises that people would be able to keep insurance plans they liked.

              Obama said insurance companies could continue for another year to offer health plans sold to individuals and small businesses that do not meet requirements under the new law that set minimum standards for the benefits that policies must cover.

              •  The cancelled plans.. (3+ / 0-)
                Recommended by:
                sulthernao, mikeVA, petesmom

                were issued after the ACA came into effect, i.e, for the years 2011, 2012, and 2013.  Any plans in effect in 2010 were grandfathered.  

                It's the insurance companies that are most at fault in the whole cancelled plans mess, and it's maddening that they are not being held to account by the media for this.  These companies issued millions of policies that they new full well were non-ACA compliant and would have to be cancelled at the end of 2013.  Did they tell their customers this?  No-o-o-o-o-o-o-o!

          •  that is a childish understanding (2+ / 0-)
            Recommended by:
            TrueBlueMajority, petesmom

            obama didn't force anyone to do anything - it's not like he is flying around the US forcing people at gunpoint to discontinue their health insurance.  this was all a massive game by the insurance companies - obama even extended the policy lifetimes by a whole friggin' year and the insurance companies are still cancelling those policies.

            It doesn't matter whether the plans were junk or not, or why the law required them to be canceled ...
            it kinda does matter that these plans were not compliant with the new insurance standards!  my old employer provided plan didn't meet with it so that old plan was canceled and a new one took it's place.  
            ... he made the promise with no exceptions, not a single one, and it was his promise to keep, because the ACA is his law.
            again, this is childish!  it was never obama's promise to keep because he wasn't selling the insurance plans!
            ... because the ACA is his law
            it is the law of the US.  it's mine, it's yours, its everyone's law.
      •  Everybody in the insurance industry (3+ / 0-)
        Recommended by:
        ladybug53, TrueBlueMajority, petesmom

        was telling the Adminstration that they could provide those outcomes.

        And the insurance companies could certainly have reached those goals.

        Thing is, there were no mandates in PPACA to ensure that these capitalist profit-maximizers and social climbers with GOP roots would follow through on what they said.

        "Obama lied" implying deliberate dishonesty is a hoax.

        And everyone should know it.

      •  Was Bush I "lying" about "Read my lips: no tax"... (0+ / 0-)

        …or his administration too incompetent doing so…? Or is it possible that working in "absolutes" is a pipe dream?

        If a statement turns out to not be true for 100% of people 100% of the time, does it make it a LIE?

        Can someone simply be "wrong" because the circumstances change OR maybe it is the fact that NO policy can be implemented to work 100% of the time for 100% of the people?

        •  That's not what happened (4+ / 0-)

          The ACA specifically allows insurance companies to continue to offer pre-ACA insurance plans. That hasn't changed - the ACA has not and cannot take anyone's insurance away.

          The ones that can take people's insurance away is insurance companies.

          What actually happened is that the insurance companies chose to cancel people's pre-ACA plans in order to try to scare people into buying more expensive insurance, and tried to blame it on the ACA. There have been several lawsuits which the insurance companies lost - they lied to their customers in an illegal attempt to con their customers, and were forced by courts to restore the cancelled plans.

          •  please keep saying THIS (2+ / 0-)
            Recommended by:
            peachcreek, petesmom
            the ACA has not and cannot take anyone's insurance away.

            The ones that can take people's insurance away is insurance companies.

            insurance companies chose to cancel people's pre-ACA plans in order to try to scare people into buying more expensive insurance, and tried to blame it on the ACA.

            these things are TRUE!

            Politics is like driving. To go backward put it in R. To go forward put it in D.
            Drop by The Grieving Room on Monday nights for support in dealing with grief.

            by TrueBlueMajority on Fri Dec 27, 2013 at 04:30:47 PM PST

            [ Parent ]

      •  I saw that as addressing the overwhelming (1+ / 0-)
        Recommended by:
        petesmom

        number of people who already had insurance-usually through the employer. There was nothing in ACA that took away their ability to keep their doctor or existing plan. Employers do it all the time though.  I've been on my husband's COBRA for six years-three different insurance companies during that time.  The problem is the 4 percent of people who buy their own or have sucky insurance through their employer.

        "Forever is composed of nows." Emily Dickinson

        by Leftovers on Fri Dec 27, 2013 at 07:12:19 PM PST

        [ Parent ]

Subscribe or Donate to support Daily Kos.

Click here for the mobile view of the site