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View Diary: Pope Francis Packs the Vatican with Vulture Capitalists (142 comments)

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  •  Dude that wasn't persuasive at all. You didn't (2+ / 0-)
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    doc2, marykk

    close the sale. Which part was the hook? Even assuming the layoffs were the cardinal sin (heh) there's two degrees of separation between the pope and Taco Bell. If he found a consultant that never recommended layoffs would he be in the clear? Is there some secret meaning in the pyramids? Maybe it's McKinsey's fee that bothers you on principle? Or because it wasn't justified considering the recommendation?

    Same thing goes for the diary. Obviously the diarist compiled a ton of info. Much is implied but where are the bodies buried? It's all style and no substance.

    The pope wrote a 224 document that doesn't even get mentioned in this diary and I don't see how progressive people can ignore it. Yes it is a big deal when we came off an election campaign featuring class war accusations, the have-nots were ridiculed and disparaged which was caught on video, hunger and poverty are blamed on deadbeats looking for a handout. It went on and on.

    It's a big deal when one public figure says to poor people, you are a human being and you are not worth less than anyone else because they're rich. In fact, it's more likely the other way around because the only way anyone can be rich is if they have something that's rightfully yours.  Calling out to people who are treated like dirt, to tell them they have power, and to speak up, no permission needed is so desperately needed.

    I can understand that people rejected what he wrote without even knowing what the content is.  Like always, there's a discussion that could be had but not many know how to do it.  The pope criticizes the church himself in the document. He doesn't flinch from anything. Even if people can't cozy up to him because he's part of a hated institution, what's wrong with grass roots people waving that piece of literature in their Congress critter's face.

    Why throw out the baby with the bathwater?

    There is no existence without doubt.

    by Mark Lippman on Sun Jan 05, 2014 at 04:07:32 PM PST

    [ Parent ]

    •  Babies are innocent. Francis is not. (0+ / 0-)
      •  If we can only heed the innocent, then who among (0+ / 0-)

        us qualifies to be heard? Hmmm? You?

        There is no existence without doubt.

        by Mark Lippman on Mon Jan 06, 2014 at 09:24:11 AM PST

        [ Parent ]

        •  I don't defend institutions that (1+ / 0-)
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          commit crimes against children and treat women as second class citizens. Seen any evidence that Francis is addressing this?  Oh yeah, he appointed a commission to study the pedophile issues and told the nuns to stop acting like old maids.  We're certainly off to a good start.

          Maybe you can tell me why, in the face of all the evidence to the country over a couple thousand years, people are willing to hop on board a peace train with a man who says nothing new and does even less. Three years ago he was calling gay marriage the work of satan and actively campaigning in Argentina against it.  Now he says "who am I to judge"?  Seems like he did a LOT of judging in Argentina. One of two things have happened... either Francis had a major change of heart on gays OR he is waging a feel good PR campaign to distract us from the pedophile issue and re-fill the emptying pews.  Now I wonder which one it is??   It blows my mind how gullible people are when it comes to this institution and its representatives.  

          •  You're not telling me anything I don't know. (0+ / 0-)

            I'm going to end up completing the case that you leave unfinished.  I appreciate what you're saying and I'm not refuting the facts you have. I'm adding.

            The topics you mentioned are in the pope's writing, by the way.  After reading all the way through it, I can't say it's a feel good PR campaign. I say he could be instigating an uprising. People throwing it back in his lap, didn't read what he wrote, or didn't understand it.

            He's giving it to people to do instead of doing it himself because the citizens of each country have their own governments to deal with.  In a similar way, the church can be changed too but not from above because people around the world want different things. We assume everyone wants what we want in the USA. He gives examples of the differing demands around the globe and how they might be accommodated individually.

            It's good to be skeptical. Is he just a wizard who wants the needy to deliver a witch's broom? Or is he opening a door because the world is at a turning point?

            I have to know what I'm dismissing before I toss it.

            There is no existence without doubt.

            by Mark Lippman on Mon Jan 06, 2014 at 12:25:51 PM PST

            [ Parent ]

            •  Well, then you will need a (1+ / 0-)
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              crystal ball and a whole lot of patience.  In the meantime, the players that he has surrounded himself with are NOT signs of an "uprising" or a "turning point".  It is the same old same old dressed up as something new. Remember, you are dealing with a person and an institution that still thinks transubstantiation is something real.

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