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View Diary: 7 Years Ago (Updated with Sources) (173 comments)

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  •  Well defined (none)
    like the medicine factory in Sudan?  Cruise missles kill innocent people the same as a ground war.  They also accomplish nothing, as they might temporariliy destroy some targets, but leave the same leadership and potentials threats intact.
    •   Cruise missles kill innocent people (none)
      And so do republicans

      If you want me to go back to the place I was born , tell your corporations to leave my country (Leon Gieco)

      by cruz del sur on Thu Jun 30, 2005 at 08:18:54 AM PDT

      [ Parent ]

    •  Okay (4.00)
      Let's call the medicine factory missile attack a mistake.  

      It was a mistake based on bad intelligence; intelligence that indicated it made chemical weapons.  Much physical damage of an individual structure ensued.  Some loss of life, primarily from the loss of the medicine the factory produced.  

      Now, let's call the Iraq invasion a mistake.  Only the true Kool-Aid drinkers by now think otherwise.

      If you believe Bush, the decision to invade was based on bad intelligence.  If you believe the British government's own documents, it was a forgone conclusion in search of an excuse.  An entire nation's infrastructure largely destroyed.  Extensive loss of life and human suffering.  The alienation of over a billion Muslims and the creation of a new terrorist training ground.

      A mistake so profound it has destroyed much of our credibility on the world stage.

      One of these is not like the other.  

      A focused, limited cruise missile attack is not equivalent to a land invasion involving extensive urban combat among a hostile populace.

      Your attempt to equate the two shows how hollow your words are.

    •  By the balls (none)
      In March 2003, the US had Saddam by the balls.  He had let inspectors in, and most likely would have agreed to other intrusive measures to avoid war, including alteration and monitoring of sanctions to ensure that food got to the recipients.

      But aside from the sudden Republican altruism with respect to the effects of sanctions, US national interest and the cost/benefits of the war should have a role.

      That the costs would greatly exceed the benefits was apparent in March 2003 and is even more apparent now. (look at deterioration in Afghan., likely creation of a failed Iraq state to foster terrorism, etc.)

      But also -- if you asked the Iraqis if they agreed to the end of sanctions through massive bombings that would kill tens of thousands of them, I think they would not have been crazy about the idea.

    •  You are correct (none)
      that Cruise missiles are often inneffective, but we simply do not have the resources to go into a ground war with every country that harbors ill will towards us. Ground wars are costly and lead to major losses for our side.
      Now after 9-11, the rules did change. 9-11 did not provide us with new resouces to launch ground wars, it did not provide new funds for a protracted conflict with a country not at all connected with 9-11, but it did provide us with renewed support from the world regarding terrorism.

      We could have, and I believe Clinton would have used that support to bring the full weight of the world down upon Terrorism.

      Instead, we got a cowboy who went off half-cocked and turned that enourmous support into the worst global anti-Americanism this country has ever seen.

      Clinton was not perfect, but he was at least following policies based in reality. That goes for Bush Sr. and even Reagan.

      In fact George Dubya is the first president who has let his ego take the reins of power to this degree.

      History will write that George W. Bush was the worst president in our long history.

    •  That was 1998 ... (none)
      be nice if you theocon toughguy fucks gave a shit about Sudan right fucking now!  Ya know, genocide, Darfur?

      'Sanctity of life' my ass.

      When you get past the apeman rhetoric, theocons are true pussies, plain and simple.

      Enlistments still down, toughguy, why don't you go fight some terraists in Iraq?

      Can I get another Amen? (Amen!) There's a flag wrapped around a score of men (Hey!) A gag, a plastic bag on a monument

      by iowasteele on Thu Jun 30, 2005 at 09:22:16 PM PDT

      [ Parent ]

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