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  •  Fixed it for ya. (6+ / 0-)
    Aren't police officers supposed to be those "responsible gun owners" we hear so many gun control advocates talk about?
    The police, after all, are usually exempted from the gun control laws.
    •  I bet if you were there with your weapon... (36+ / 0-)

      ... this never would have happened.

      "Bob Johnson doesn't have special privileges, because really, why would I entrust that guy with ANYTHING?" - kos, November 9, 2013

      by Bob Johnson on Mon Jan 13, 2014 at 07:32:12 PM PST

      [ Parent ]

      •  I'll take that bet (0+ / 0-)

        How much do you want to lose?
        This is Florida we're talking about here

        Happy just to be alive

        by exlrrp on Mon Jan 13, 2014 at 07:35:12 PM PST

        [ Parent ]

        •  Just another fucking idiot with a concealed weapon (34+ / 0-)

          "Bob Johnson doesn't have special privileges, because really, why would I entrust that guy with ANYTHING?" - kos, November 9, 2013

          by Bob Johnson on Mon Jan 13, 2014 at 07:38:19 PM PST

          [ Parent ]

          •  Is that a surprise? (1+ / 0-)
            Recommended by:
            Tortmaster

            Like I said, it IS Florida

            Happy just to be alive

            by exlrrp on Mon Jan 13, 2014 at 07:41:01 PM PST

            [ Parent ]

            •  Could be anywhere. (19+ / 0-)

              Thanks to people like our fearless gun toter, above, and the NRA, idiots with concealed guns are in all 50 states.

              "Bob Johnson doesn't have special privileges, because really, why would I entrust that guy with ANYTHING?" - kos, November 9, 2013

              by Bob Johnson on Mon Jan 13, 2014 at 07:44:03 PM PST

              [ Parent ]

              •  Depends a lot on where you live (0+ / 0-)

                And I mean a whole lot

                Happy just to be alive

                by exlrrp on Mon Jan 13, 2014 at 07:49:02 PM PST

                [ Parent ]

              •  Criminals with concealed guns were in all 50 (2+ / 0-)
                Recommended by:
                high uintas, Wisdumb

                states already.

                Not to mention LEOs like the guy above...

                •  Oh, was this guy a criminal? (13+ / 0-)

                  "Bob Johnson doesn't have special privileges, because really, why would I entrust that guy with ANYTHING?" - kos, November 9, 2013

                  by Bob Johnson on Mon Jan 13, 2014 at 07:55:21 PM PST

                  [ Parent ]

                  •  He was a police officer. Perhaps you didn't (0+ / 0-)

                    open the comment to read it Bob?

                    •  Right. He was trained. (12+ / 0-)

                      What's your point?do you carry a weapon to defend yourself from police officers?

                      "Bob Johnson doesn't have special privileges, because really, why would I entrust that guy with ANYTHING?" - kos, November 9, 2013

                      by Bob Johnson on Mon Jan 13, 2014 at 08:00:05 PM PST

                      [ Parent ]

                      •  What is your point (4+ / 0-)

                        He was a cop now he's a criminal. We all can agree on that.

                        And daddy won't you take me back to Muhlenberg County Down by the Green River where Paradise lay. Well, I'm sorry my son, but you're too late in asking Mister Peabody's coal train has hauled it away. John Prine

                        by high uintas on Mon Jan 13, 2014 at 08:32:10 PM PST

                        [ Parent ]

                        •  Oh, but he was a responsible gun owner... (19+ / 0-)

                          ... right up until he wasn't. Just like I wrote, above: another fucking idiot who feels he needs to carry a gun at all times.

                          "Bob Johnson doesn't have special privileges, because really, why would I entrust that guy with ANYTHING?" - kos, November 9, 2013

                          by Bob Johnson on Mon Jan 13, 2014 at 08:35:34 PM PST

                          [ Parent ]

                          •  That guy was an idiot (0+ / 0-)

                            no doubt. Clearly he wasn't responsible, he pulled a gun on an unarmed man who as far as I know hadn't hit him or made him fear for his life.

                            How you could think he was reflective of a "responsible gun owner" beggars belief. But, if you have a personal agenda you have to fix facts to make them fit.

                            And daddy won't you take me back to Muhlenberg County Down by the Green River where Paradise lay. Well, I'm sorry my son, but you're too late in asking Mister Peabody's coal train has hauled it away. John Prine

                            by high uintas on Mon Jan 13, 2014 at 08:51:16 PM PST

                            [ Parent ]

                          •  How do you tell the responsible gun owners from (13+ / 0-)

                            ... the irresponsible gun owners before they make that transition? That's the problem with concealed carry.

                            "Bob Johnson doesn't have special privileges, because really, why would I entrust that guy with ANYTHING?" - kos, November 9, 2013

                            by Bob Johnson on Mon Jan 13, 2014 at 10:27:11 PM PST

                            [ Parent ]

                          •  Bob (0+ / 0-)

                            Right now I am trying to help a woman who's husband is abusive. How did she know that before she married him? Stats show that each year 237, 868 people are sexually assaulted in this country. How do we know if that nice guy we just talked to will rape us?

                            We have a huge problem with violence in this country and to narrow it down to just guns and further to concealed carry is beyond me.

                            I understand people having a problem with CC, but I know women who carry because of what I put above. Some people feel they might need to protect themselves and I don't think it should be fodder for jokes.

                            I told you before that I carried an aluminum baseball bat with me everywhere for a year because my nephew in law had threatened to kill me and meant it. I figured I stood a chance 'cus he was a knife guy. The only thing that came between me and a bad situation was the legal system.

                            We can't always know the circumstances of people we read about. Life is more complicated than one liners.

                            And daddy won't you take me back to Muhlenberg County Down by the Green River where Paradise lay. Well, I'm sorry my son, but you're too late in asking Mister Peabody's coal train has hauled it away. John Prine

                            by high uintas on Tue Jan 14, 2014 at 10:57:40 AM PST

                            [ Parent ]

                          •  What about the rest? (2+ / 0-)
                            Recommended by:
                            churchylafemme, a2nite

                            Historically, carrying a weapon has been a restricted privilege in most places. Women who were being stalked were often among those allowed to carry.

                            What about all of the jackasses who are racists but carry guns, like Zimmerman, because they're afraid of "scray black people?"

                            The problem is that the gun zealots, the gun makers and their (unofficial) lobbying arm, the NRA, have made spreading weapons far and wide the law in this country.

                            It's insane.

                            We have more guns per capita than any other nation on Earth. By a mile. Why?

                            "Bob Johnson doesn't have special privileges, because really, why would I entrust that guy with ANYTHING?" - kos, November 9, 2013

                            by Bob Johnson on Tue Jan 14, 2014 at 11:58:39 AM PST

                            [ Parent ]

                          •  I agree that it has become (0+ / 0-)

                            and over the top phenomena.

                            Here is the way I look at it.

                            On one hand you have things like ALEC passing virtually identical laws in states sweeping away any regulations on gun ownership.

                            On the other hand you have people who rail against guns, talk about them as if they have minds of their own and that owners are helpless against their power.

                            Mix those two influences and you see the kind of extremism and freaking out in the gun owning population that we are seeing now. If you favor gun control then you are going about it the wrong way.

                            The NRA needn't be so influential if there wasn't something for them to fight against. They aren't representative of gun owners, only the industry and the right wing, but you have to have credibility in the gun world to get gun owners to see that.

                            It is a heavy lift to start with but as long as people like Lawrence O keeps giving them "Guns are evil" sound bites they have nothing to worry about.

                            If we want to craft laws that are effective on the gun side of this then we need to involve gun owners and make those laws be smart. No banning of a big scary looking gun that is no different from a non scary gun.

                            No random numbers pulled from one's ass on clip size. Put a top limit on it but remember different guns come with different sized clips. 7? 9? Senseless BS. Don't make buying and owning a gun a major hassle, but do everything you can to weed out those who shouldn't have one.

                            I favor a background check that doesn't deny the right to non-violent felons but does to people who have ever been convicted on any legal level of a crime of violence. So a felon pot dealer from 20 yrs ago can buy a gun and a misdemeanor spousal abuse conviction makes it a no no.

                            Trying to reel in concealed carry laws is damn near impossible in this climate. States like Florida come near to rewarding people for shooting others, that has to stop. Targeting the more egregious parts of the Castle Doctrine laws is possible now, people are not down with stuff like what happened in this case.

                            Let's work on those laws and the people who feel that they can shoot with impunity. You can carry your gun but the bar for proving you needed to use it must be made very high, IMO.

                            Long ass comment I know, but this is how I approach this subject. It is too complicated to just shout sound bites no matter which side you are on.

                            And daddy won't you take me back to Muhlenberg County Down by the Green River where Paradise lay. Well, I'm sorry my son, but you're too late in asking Mister Peabody's coal train has hauled it away. John Prine

                            by high uintas on Tue Jan 14, 2014 at 07:26:49 PM PST

                            [ Parent ]

                          •  Sorry. This is just a steaming load: (3+ / 0-)
                            Recommended by:
                            FogCityJohn, churchylafemme, a2nite
                            The NRA needn't be so influential if there wasn't something for them to fight against. They aren't representative of gun owners, only the industry and the right wing, but you have to have credibility in the gun world to get gun owners to see that.
                            What are you talking about? The NRA does the bidding of the gun makers. Period. They aren't "fighting against" anything. They are setting up lucrative markets for their sponsors. And they do that by stoking fear.

                            Why do you think a guy like the leader of RKBA here totes a gun at all times and rails against, what he considers, the crime-ingested urban jungles? He has bought into the culture of fear, lock, stock and barrel.

                            Let's not forget that for decades, the NRA was an organization dedicated to promoting hunting, sport shooting and gun collecting. When hunting began its steep decline in the `70s, the NRA and the gun makers had to open new sales channels to stoke gun sales. So what did they do? Begin promoting "guns-as-self-defense."

                            Look at the gun toters here. They're afraid to go to New York or Chicago. Think I'm kidding? Read some of the posts from the fearless leader of the RKBA.

                            Fuck that. This country is awash in guns. We have more guns per capita than any other country in the world. By a long shot. It's fucked up and the NRA and its minions -- aided and abetted by idiots like the RKBA king here, intentionally or unintentionally -- are the enemies of a civilized society. In fact, the King RKBA here says we are NOT a civilized society and that's one of the reasons he carries a weapon.

                            Of course, he neglects to observe that one of the reasons he believes that is that this country is flooded with guns, particularly, handguns.

                            He is part of the problem, not solution.

                            As for this...

                            Let's work on those laws and the people who feel that they can shoot with impunity. You can carry your gun but the bar for proving you needed to use it must be made very high, IMO.
                            Talk about niggling around the edges... In a civilized society, people should not be walking around carrying guns.

                            We need to talk about much bigger issues than what you want to talk about. We are the laughing stock of the civilized world. For good reason. Our gun policies are insane.

                            "Bob Johnson doesn't have special privileges, because really, why would I entrust that guy with ANYTHING?" - kos, November 9, 2013

                            by Bob Johnson on Tue Jan 14, 2014 at 10:15:39 PM PST

                            [ Parent ]

                          •  First (0+ / 0-)

                            Of course the NRA is fighting. They are fear mongering and working on it constantly. We just give the NRA the fuel and they to out and use it. The are amoral and will take any advantage that they can.

                            Reread the thing you quoted before you start talking about steaming loads, I said in it that they only represent the industry and the right wing, not the gun owners.

                            Your problem w/kvoi is over the top. He is no threat to you, he merely has a different view of things. You can't stand it. I've got to give it to kvoi, he's gotten under your skin and it shows.

                            You say the country is awash in guns, yet you do nothing constructive to change that. You content yourself with being a smart ass on a blog and attacking another kossack.

                            What would you do legally? Could it pass? Do you know any gun owners and have you ever talked to them about what they would go for? A little more than third of the population owns guns and many of them are Democrats.

                             You aren't Harry Potter you know, you have to pass laws not just demand that things are as you wish. So Bob, that means you have to craft laws that others agree with. Simple.

                            You want something bigger than what I suggested but you can't get it. You can't ban them and the more you push the more they push back. So you end up being about as effective as the House is right now.

                            But, go ahead and chase kvoi around the threads. That'll do it.

                            And daddy won't you take me back to Muhlenberg County Down by the Green River where Paradise lay. Well, I'm sorry my son, but you're too late in asking Mister Peabody's coal train has hauled it away. John Prine

                            by high uintas on Tue Jan 14, 2014 at 10:48:42 PM PST

                            [ Parent ]

                          •  No, not a third of the population. (1+ / 0-)
                            Recommended by:
                            churchylafemme

                            Why repeat that lie? A third of households Own guns. Not a "third of the population."

                            Your idea that it's best not to stir the hornets' nest that is the NRA reminds me of the advice we used to see against standing up for liberal and progressive principles, particularly, opposition to the Iraq war early on...

                            "They'll use it against us!"

                            The NRA will do what they do, regardless, because their sole purpose is selling more guns. Doesn't make any difference what we do or say. Your claim is a fallacy. They are the assholes who fear-mongered with "Obama wants to take your guns away!"

                            As for King RKBA "getting under my skin," you are sadly mistaken. He merely represents the very worst of the so-called "Liberal Gun Club."

                            As I have noted many times, their slogan should be:

                            More liberal than the NRA.
                            On everything except guns.
                            The gun toters, in particular, are more resistant to any meaningful reforms than most gun owners.

                            The primary issue regarding guns in this country is that it's just too damn easy to get one. That's why we have such an inordinate number of them in circulation relative to the rest of the world (a point you continue to ignore). It's an insane, irrational culture.

                            I am not worried about giving the NRA a cause against which to fight. They don't need that. They just make shit up. And stir fear among white guys. They're very good at that as the RKBA's fearless leader's comments will attest.

                            "Bob Johnson doesn't have special privileges, because really, why would I entrust that guy with ANYTHING?" - kos, November 9, 2013

                            by Bob Johnson on Wed Jan 15, 2014 at 05:25:32 AM PST

                            [ Parent ]

                          •  I stand by my number and it may be higher (0+ / 0-)

                            Counting individuals is almost impossible, the why of it is in this article. Many people will not admit to owning.

                            You have it backwards. You give the people who are inclined to listen to the NRA the impetus to become more obstinate and get no where. The goal is to minimize the power of the NRA so that we can move forward.

                            Those who support the NRA believe that the organization protects their rights. They don't give a shit as long as members, who can't even vote for leaders, pay their dues. I want to get those people to see that they are being duped and it won't happen if we demonize them.

                            I stand for liberal and progressive values and one of them is not messing w/the Bill of Rights. The Fourth is just about toast because people decided that for their own safety they didn't need it. Draw your own conclusions.

                            Yes, you are obsessed with kvoi. He founded RKBA but isn't King of anything and speaks only for himself. You can't help but mention him, if he comments you are there, why can't you just accept that his views are his views and differ from yours? He is only one person.

                            And daddy won't you take me back to Muhlenberg County Down by the Green River where Paradise lay. Well, I'm sorry my son, but you're too late in asking Mister Peabody's coal train has hauled it away. John Prine

                            by high uintas on Wed Jan 15, 2014 at 09:45:01 AM PST

                            [ Parent ]

                          •  Heh. (1+ / 0-)
                            Recommended by:
                            churchylafemme

                            Gun ownership has been in steady decline. But gun owners own more guns.

                            The NRA is tasked with marketing guns. Some of that marketing effort involves lobbying for things like Stand Your Ground laws. That helps promote their climate of fear. That helps scare white guys into buying handguns and carrying their guns with them.

                            You, again, refuse to acknowledge that our gun culture is completely out of whack relative to the rest of the civilized world. Falling back on the constitutional argument is weak.

                            Specifically, more stringent restrictions on gun sales, particularly handguns, is not something that is supported by most of the RKBA members here, and it doesn't infringe on the Second Amendment.

                            And the gun toters, like the founder of RKBA here, are even more adamant than gun owners who use their guns for hunting or other typical rural America purposes.

                            As for this hokum...

                            Those who support the NRA believe that the organization protects their rights. They don't give a shit as long as members, who can't even vote for leaders, pay their dues. I want to get those people to see that they are being duped and it won't happen if we demonize them.
                            ... don't make me laugh. How do you propose to get NRA members to "see that they are being duped?"

                            "Bob Johnson doesn't have special privileges, because really, why would I entrust that guy with ANYTHING?" - kos, November 9, 2013

                            by Bob Johnson on Wed Jan 15, 2014 at 11:37:11 AM PST

                            [ Parent ]

                          •  I didn't know I had to acknowledge (0+ / 0-)

                            our gun culture vs the world. I agree, we have a lot of guns.

                            How do you get around the Constitution? I'm not falling back on a Constitutional argument, I'm literally part of RKBA because of it. As I've said many times I don't own a gun, never have.

                            Unless you are planning a Constitutional Convention in this political climate this is the world that you live in. Pending other rulings from SCOTUS you see before you the chess board, how do you play it?

                            The majority of NRA members are not active, they join to be able to use firing ranges or as part of a duck group or wild turkey hunt club. They don't spend their day being directly involve in NRA bullshit.

                            Those are the people who can be reached, the people who have no idea that the leadership is a closed loop that is not responsive to membership and are merely industry shills.

                            I enumerated in another comment what I would like to see re: background checks w/teeth and clip limits. I would like to limit legal purchases to let's say one a month with feedback to the national background check database. We need to end straw purchases.

                            As for handguns, I believe that most of the murders are done with handguns and seldom make the news. Yet, I remember all the yelping about "assault rifles". I was then and am now more concerned about the illegal sale of handguns.

                            How do we stop the illegal sales w/out messing with the legal sales? Once we get a purchase limit and hopefully slowdown the illegal sales we have to work on what is already on the street and then you are getting into a bigger can of worms.

                            I'm not against gun buy backs. I would like to see more outreach to communities where gun violence is high. This is a multi pronged problem and we need more than one simple solution because there is none.

                            Again, you bring up kvoi. You have to let him go, Bob. He is who he is, you are who you are and there is no reason that you should be so invested in tearing him down.

                            RKBA is a big group of people with different ideas and agendas. We agree that the 2nd is worth preserving and have a goal of getting gun owners to come to the Democratic side, we want them to see that many of them have more in common and will be better served by supporting a progressive agenda.

                            That last part is key to why kvoi started RKBA.

                            And daddy won't you take me back to Muhlenberg County Down by the Green River where Paradise lay. Well, I'm sorry my son, but you're too late in asking Mister Peabody's coal train has hauled it away. John Prine

                            by high uintas on Wed Jan 15, 2014 at 03:33:15 PM PST

                            [ Parent ]

                          •  How do you tell the innocent from (0+ / 0-)

                            .......the guilty before they make that transition?

                            Looks like you found a problem with a free society.

                            Those who would sacrifice liberty for security deserve neither.

                            by FrankRose on Tue Jan 14, 2014 at 09:31:19 PM PST

                            [ Parent ]

                    •  Retired LEO. emphasis on WAS nt (0+ / 0-)
                    •  Yeah, one of your good guys with a gun. nt. (3+ / 0-)
                      Recommended by:
                      mrkvica, earlybird, FogCityJohn

                      "The first drawback of anger is that it destroys your inner peace; the second is that it distorts your view of reality. If you come to understand that anger is really unhelpful, you can begin to distance yourself from anger." - The Dalai Lama

                      by auron renouille on Tue Jan 14, 2014 at 03:23:24 AM PST

                      [ Parent ]

          •  More to the point, another idiot who *unconcealed* (10+ / 0-)

            his weapon instead of just walking out to the lobby to get the manager or whomever.

            At 71 he'll certainly die in prison; sadly it will likely do absolutely nothing to help prevent it from happening again.

            Florida: just one more place guns make everyone feel "safer".

            Signature (this will be attached to your comments)

            by here4tehbeer on Mon Jan 13, 2014 at 08:35:01 PM PST

            [ Parent ]

      •  In fact, odds are several people were carrying (0+ / 0-)

        guns in that theater.

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