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View Diary: Eco-advocates deeply unhappy with Keystone XL pipeline review. Rep. Grijalva calls it a 'sham' (79 comments)

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  •  This pipeline would cross (20+ / 0-)

    the Ogallala aquifer with the dirtiest type of oil there is. I realize there are pipelines over it already, but not carrying this dirty of product. Much midwest agriculture depends on this aquifer.

    Ceiling Cat rules....srsly.

    by side pocket on Fri Jan 31, 2014 at 04:34:43 PM PST

    •  Which is already down by half. n/t (3+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      side pocket, Dragon5616, NoMoreLies

      ~Arianna_Editrix-- I willingly accept Cassandra’s fate, To speak the truth, altho’ believ’d too late

      by Arianna Editrix on Fri Jan 31, 2014 at 04:57:53 PM PST

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      •  Half since when? According to... (2+ / 0-)
        Recommended by:
        Eric Nelson, side pocket

        ...this site, the aquifer lost a total of 9% 1950-2009, accelerating to 2% 2001-2009.  

        Don't tell me what you believe, show me what you do and I will tell you what you believe.

        by Meteor Blades on Fri Jan 31, 2014 at 05:12:48 PM PST

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        •  Two links (0+ / 0-)

          If you need more, I'll drill down on the EPA report from August '11 and Canadian one too.  It's what is known as ancient water (aquifer formed and then was overlaid by pretty impermeable rock strata) it's only 100 deep, we've already sucked off the top 50 and is not replenished by rainfall very easily. I live atop the dang thing and we've been in a drought since before '04.  

          http://canadians.org/...

          http://dornsife-blogs.usc.edu/...

          ~Arianna_Editrix-- I willingly accept Cassandra’s fate, To speak the truth, altho’ believ’d too late

          by Arianna Editrix on Fri Jan 31, 2014 at 05:28:55 PM PST

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          •  The Ogallalla formation is 1000 feet deep... (3+ / 0-)
            Recommended by:
            Eric Nelson, geez53, side pocket

            ...in some sections, a few feet in others. In parts, the water-saturated portion is 400 feet. I wrote about it several times in the 1970s and early '80s when concerns about this fossil water being depleted were first raised. It IS being depleted, but I have never read any study saying it has lost half its volume.

            Don't tell me what you believe, show me what you do and I will tell you what you believe.

            by Meteor Blades on Fri Jan 31, 2014 at 06:11:00 PM PST

            [ Parent ]

            •  Sorry, dropped a zero on those for some reason (1+ / 0-)
              Recommended by:
              side pocket

              And the 1000/500 depth is from a study doing overall availability as in there are X number of acre feet available.  I'm crashing through old studies trying to find it.  I have been working with this for about two years now because of the fracking and the attempt by P. to buy St. Louis water company and the farmers going broke buying water, etc.  Are you in the mid MidWest? Thanks for what you do.
              ~Ari

              ~Arianna_Editrix-- I willingly accept Cassandra’s fate, To speak the truth, altho’ believ’d too late

              by Arianna Editrix on Fri Jan 31, 2014 at 06:31:58 PM PST

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              •  No. I lived in Colorado for three decades... (1+ / 0-)
                Recommended by:
                side pocket

                ...and now almost three decades in California.

                Don't tell me what you believe, show me what you do and I will tell you what you believe.

                by Meteor Blades on Fri Jan 31, 2014 at 07:09:14 PM PST

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                •  Ah, the drought has you now (1+ / 0-)
                  Recommended by:
                  PSzymeczek

                  I hear my MIL bitch all the time about the drought in CO, and my bff lives outside LA.  Growing up in AZ I watched as we sold our water to CA by the river full......and now the reservoirs are going dry to the bone.  I wonder what will happen when we all dry up and blow away?

                  ~Arianna_Editrix-- I willingly accept Cassandra’s fate, To speak the truth, altho’ believ’d too late

                  by Arianna Editrix on Fri Jan 31, 2014 at 09:32:10 PM PST

                  [ Parent ]

    •  Scariest part of this (for my grandchildren). (1+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      side pocket

      Murphy's law.

      Should preface by saying that we were working on a refined product line the morning of 9/11. Or more correctly we were supposed to tap a product line that morning (didn't touch it for a week as it turned out). I mention it only to illustrate that anything that can go wrong, will.

      Ruptures and breaks aren't as scarey as some small leak that goes undetected for weeks or months, saturates the trench, finds one of the few permeable channels that drain into the Ogallala.

      Every piece of pipe will be inspected, every inch of every weld will be x-rayed and big oil has a great self interest in this thing Not leaking. But still ...... there's Murphy ..... and a first hand knowledge that everything we've built has broken at some point.

      21st Century America: The distracted, superficial perception of a virtual reality. Gettov Milawn

      by geez53 on Fri Jan 31, 2014 at 08:11:09 PM PST

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      •  every weld will be x-rayed (0+ / 0-)

        By the same folks who inspected every inch of the Alaskan Pipeline? They will only make copies of good radiographs, to show the Feds, never of bad ones? Just like on the Alaskan Pipeline?

        Maintenance will be by the same folks who's pipelines have been rupturing already.

        •  Not in Illinois at least. (0+ / 0-)

          Beyond the regs and record keeping, there's a dynamic among the welders and welding crews. Proof-of-pride sort of thing. We had one bad joint (too much porosity), out of hundreds, close to fist fight situation ensued and 3 days of a totally humorless crew. And some worry about the bot welder if quality lags.

          21st Century America: The distracted, superficial perception of a virtual reality. Gettov Milawn

          by geez53 on Sat Feb 01, 2014 at 12:46:22 PM PST

          [ Parent ]

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