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View Diary: Right-wing bigots up in arms over Super Bowl commercial. No, another one. (454 comments)

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  •  It's their business. (20+ / 0-)

    Many can not make a similar paying living by work.  Instead, they gin out right wing outrage and then fleece the suckers.

    Join us on the Black Kos front porch to review news and views written from a black pov—everyone is welcome.

    by TomP on Mon Feb 03, 2014 at 11:28:50 AM PST

    [ Parent ]

    •  Well, they'll have plenty of room to bitch (1+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      Gary Owen

      When Congress and the POTUS fuck up and legislate an official language for this once great nation.

      Until then, the only thing that they can do is make fools of themselves.

      •  Nothing wrong with having one official language. (1+ / 0-)
        Recommended by:

        You may have noticed, or perhaps not, that only one group of people clamor for the "right" to get communications in their native language. That's the group of people who speak Spanish.

        Have you ever seen anyone from Vietnam or Malaysia or Taiwan or anywhere else in the non-Spanish world DEMAND that the US government publish information in their language?

        Shall we have STOP signs with 30-50 different languages on them? Oh no, it's only the Hispanics that want it to say ALTO. They don't care if our Nepalese immigrants have to learn English. But they sure aren't going to learn it, not while they have this much political power in the US. And liberals jump right up supporting their RIGHT to demand we include their language, and ONLY their language into our new DUAL language system, right?

        Sheesh. Liberals need to start looking at the big picture and stop being such tools for other people, especially Hispanic immigrants, who want their needs, and only their needs, taken care of.

        •  Spanish..... (8+ / 0-)

          ....happens to be the  "official language" of Puerto Rico, which - if you haven't noticed = is part of the United States by virtue of conquest. So is Guam.
          Maybe you'd be better off if you defined "American" by the values they hold rather than the language they speak.

          Don't believe eveything you think.

          by boguseconomist on Tue Feb 04, 2014 at 05:28:03 PM PST

          [ Parent ]

          •  I kinda agreed with SpaK... (0+ / 0-)

            but your comment nails it, especially because the first Spanish in America were here longer than any other Europeans...I just wish I hadn't taken French in grammar school instead of Spanish, because all the pretty girls took French, which I didn't learn.

            If corporations are people now, do they have to get a fishing license? To catch CARP?

          •  And the co-official language of New Mexico (0+ / 0-)

            The Constitution of the State of New Mexico, and all of its state laws, are officially in English and Spanish.  After all, the Mexican citizens were there FIRST, and English-speaking USA absorbed them.  The first generation (1848) were probably not too happy about it, but their children started to like it, and even today the DESCENDANTS of Mexicans absorbed into the U.S. are a substantial fraction, if not the majority, of residents of New Mexico.

        •  STOP sign is a bad choice (2+ / 0-)
          Recommended by:
          Gary Owen, HSans

          it's already in the universal language of a red octagon.

        •  Those were Americans singing (21+ / 0-)

          In San Francisco's Chinatown they have stop signs in two languages. In Orange County Little Saigon has miles of business signs in Vietnamese ONLY. Our ballots in Texas are printed in two languages, instructions up on the wall in English, Spanish, Vietnamese and Chinese. You can pick up a DMV handbook in several languages in most states. In our courts they will provide interpreters so that justice may be served. My US Passport is printed in English and French (a tradition going back to when French was the language of diplomacy). The Census bureau recognizes 382 languages in use here in the US of A. Even the State of Illinois translates at least one website into Klingon for gods sake!

          Those were Americans singing and we will provide for them. My family were immigrants once, we came over during the Armenian genocide about 100 years back through Ellis Island. Someone helped my family once, so I will pay it forward to the next generation of immigrants and we will be the stronger for it.

          •  Coke ad (3+ / 0-)
            Recommended by:
            HSans, fittobetied, a gilas girl

            Very well said. Thank you

          •  With all due respect it costs A LOT of taxpayer (0+ / 0-)

            money to translate into other languages for those who refuse to learn our language. And when foreigners refuse to integrate into the rest of society then they victimize themselves. I once shared a hospital room with an hispanic woman who was in some sort of distress and they had to search for someone to translate, which took several minutes. Fortunately it was nothing serious, but what if it had been?

            You yourself said that there are 382 languages spoken here so it makes sense to me to have ONE main language, English. Many immigrants who come here are critical of those who choose not to learn english. I know a couple of German women who feel that way. In fact one has been here since 1976 and is still not shy about asking about a word she doesn't know!

            If these people want to be Americans then why don't they join the rest of us instead of hiding in their communities and expecting the rest of us to learn THEIR languages!

            In southern CA where I live it is almost impossible to get a job unless you are bi-lingual in spanish. Why? If I moved south of the border I doubt ANYONE would bother learning English in order to serve my needs, nor would I expect them to!

             Having said that I certainly do think that there is an over-reaction by conservatives about this ad. I think it was only meant to express the diversity of this culture in America.

            •  It's not a "refusal to learn" (4+ / 0-)

              learning a new language takes time.  Learning a language to the degree that one can competently interact in complex relationships and encounters (such as the courts, the health care field, the human services networks) requires a level of proficiency that large numbers of these new Americans will develop over time.

              In the meantime, it costs our systems more money in waste, error, and the potential risk factors for folks not understanding what our systems require than it does to translate and interpret.  And it helps our professionals be better at their jobs, too.  The translations aren't simply for the non-English speaking parts of the public.  They are also for the English-speaking parts that serve those populations.

              It's cheap in those terms.

              Words can sometimes, in moments of grace, attain the quality of deeds. --Elie Wiesel

              by a gilas girl on Wed Feb 05, 2014 at 08:39:49 AM PST

              [ Parent ]

              •  I totally agree, and would also point out (3+ / 0-)

                that we have plenty of natural-born, native speakers of English in this country who don't have the proficiency to competently interact in complex relationships and encounters - or even use basic 4th-grade grammar when posting on the internet. Yet these are often the ones complaining the loudest that "immigrants should learn English".

              •  Okay I do get some of your points (0+ / 0-)

                however yes there ARE MANY who REFUSE to learn english. I know that because I have met them. Quite often their children learn English in school but the parents will remain life-long speakers of spanish only.

                I used to work in a mental health social center where we tried to do outreach to the hispanic community. It was difficult to get them to come since mostly english speaking people went there. We had a spanish speaking support group but could not get anyone to come. One hispanic lady did come periodically to our center to participate in karoake but in the entire time I knew her over several years she did not bother to learn even ONE word of english.

                This is what I am talking about is that they CUT THEMSELVES OFF from the rest of us and often make it virtually impossible to provide services for them.

                At the very least they should be required to know english when applying for citizenship. Why do we need voters ballots in spanish? Sometimes I get mail meant for an hispanic neighbor of mine and I notice that letters from social security are printed in spanish. Again why? If you are a citizen and have a social security number then you ought to know english.

            •  The singers in the commercial all speak English (0+ / 0-)

              It isn't clear whether your comment is in regard to the singers in this commercial, specifically, or the language skills of immigrants in general. But there are some "behind the scenes" videos that Coke has released about the making of this commercial, and I can tell you, the various singers in the commercial are all bilingual and speak English just fine, in addition to the language they were singing in.

              We are caught in an inescapable network of mutuality, tied in a single garment of destiny. Whatever affects one directly, affects all indirectly.

              by dconrad on Thu Feb 06, 2014 at 09:02:54 AM PST

              [ Parent ]

            •  Money (0+ / 0-)

              Of course - it's only about money.  When there's no other argument that holds water, let's just say it's about money.  This may come as a surprise, but life is not just about money.

              And to follow up on the 'there's nothing wrong with having just one official language' sentiment upstream, Switzerland has three official languages and they seem to get along just fine.

              "The French have no word for entrepreneur!" G. W. Bush

              by bbuudd on Thu Feb 06, 2014 at 01:29:16 PM PST

              [ Parent ]

          •  A great reply (0+ / 0-)

            to an idiotic post. Well done!

          •  This ^^^ is the answer (0+ / 0-)

            to so much of the crap...

            Thank you so much for joining the conversation and modelling the A-response.

            Welcome from the DK Partners & Mentors Team. If you have any questions about how to participate here, you can learn more at the Knowledge Base or from the New Diarists Resources Diaries. Diaries labeled "Open Thread" are also great places to ask. We look forward to your contributions.

            Words can sometimes, in moments of grace, attain the quality of deeds. --Elie Wiesel

            by a gilas girl on Wed Feb 05, 2014 at 08:40:59 AM PST

            [ Parent ]

          •  In New Jersey (0+ / 0-)

            In our area, you can find signs in English, Korean, Chinese, Japanese, and other languages that Americans speak.

            Sometimes, you need a sensa uma!

            by HashHoward on Wed Feb 05, 2014 at 11:40:51 AM PST

            [ Parent ]

        •  Exactly Right parent. (2+ / 0-)
          Recommended by:
          Lilredhead, YellerKitty

          Exactly Right, parent.  Just because they have all of this political power, as a huge voting bloc, what makes them think they can impact our democratic system.  What about our right to kick anyone's ass, take what we want, and dictate the culture for all?  I am so tired of Hispanics, blacks, native Americans, etc. infringing on my rights.  What did we ever do to them?

        •  "Sheesh" Conservatives... (0+ / 0-)

          Need to stop lumping everyone in together. I was with you, until you were a tool about it at the end.

          I don't mind an official language-and I don't mind making room for others, either.

        •  This is absolutely not true at all (0+ / 0-)

          Yes, I have seen this, as it is the residents right, under Title Vi of the Civil Rights Act.

          I do believe you know not of what you speak.

          Welcome from the DK Partners & Mentors Team. If you have any questions about how to participate here, you can learn more at the Knowledge Base or from the New Diarists Resources Diaries. Diaries labeled "Open Thread" are also great places to ask. We look forward to your contributions.

          Words can sometimes, in moments of grace, attain the quality of deeds. --Elie Wiesel

          by a gilas girl on Wed Feb 05, 2014 at 08:34:23 AM PST

          [ Parent ]

        •  Idiot-speak (0+ / 0-)

          For your information, Hispanic Americans have NOT "demanded" bi-lingual signs, or bank machines, or anything else.  That is all COMPLETELY VOLUNTARY.

          How dare you put words in my mouth?  How dare you call me a "tool."  Pop your big ol' noggin out of your rectum and smell the freedom.

          Because that's what multi-culturalism is... inclusion, not substitution.  Nobody wants to take away your culture, your church, or anything.  We just want to make a place for a wide range of people who deserve it.

        •  We all are the same (0+ / 0-)

          My grandparents came from the Ukraine and Poland and they wanted to learn English. They wanted to become Americans so badly.  In the home they spoke both languages but learned to speak English remarkably well without any education.  They wanted to immerse themselves in our culture.  I wish everyone who came here felt that way.  If you go to a foreign country you must adapt to their customs. I know most of the world speaks English but you still must learn their language.  The same should be done here.  I am far from being a conservative but we have to be sensible and reasonable.  

          •  Second language (0+ / 0-)

            My Dad was borne into a Pennsylvania Dutch household.  While his parents spoke their language at home [along with their relatives and even at church], his mother forbade their children from learning it.  Would not allow it.

            Why?  Not because of any 'patriotic duty' crap.  Because when she was a girl, the kids she went to school with ridiculed her - if she spoke Pennsylvania Dutch with her siblings, or if she spoke English with an accent.  She knew how ugly the 'real Americans' were and did not want her children to put up with it.

            So - Dad and his siblings were English-only speakers.  All 8 of them expressed sadness over never learning the language of their ancestors.

            "The French have no word for entrepreneur!" G. W. Bush

            by bbuudd on Thu Feb 06, 2014 at 01:41:08 PM PST

            [ Parent ]

        •  I'm Cajun. (0+ / 0-)

          And the only reason I'm speaking English is the beloved librul public school system beat my grandparents and their generation any time they spoke French in the classroom.

          The government made them ashamed of their language and so they didn't teach it to their children, my parents, who then did not know it to teach it to me.

          It's a distinct dialect of French, in fact, and has words in it that are different from Standard French, as well as a simpler grammatical structure, almost like the difference between Latin and Italian.

          And now it's dying because of you damn English Firsters.

          And I'm just as American as you are.

          And what about Native Americans?  The first language spoken here wasn't English.  There never HAS been one single language spoken here.

          What about the Amish?  Old High German.  I've heard them speaking it.

          Canada is officially bilingual.  I don't see them going broke or falling apart, thank you.  Switzerland has three official languages, last I heard.  They're not exactly suffering either.

      •   (0+ / 0-)

        What does an "official language" have to do with a soda commercial?  Do you want to ban people from speaking their preferred language?  I can see the point of doing government business in (a) specified language(s), but what kind of "free country" do we have if we can't enjoy our diversity in private life?

      •  We NEVER had an "official" language! (0+ / 0-)

        The Founding Fathers felt no need to spell out in our Constitution or any federal statute that one language was "official" and others were not.  The majority language was English (although there were many Germans living in Pennsylvania, many of them, ironically, defecting Hessian soldiers hired by the British, and anti-British sentiment did tempt some legislators to suggest giving up English to spite the "mother" country), but our tradition of FREEDOM did not seem agreeable with a coerced official language, much less a coerced standard of spelling or grammar (as enforced by the Academie Francaise or the Academia Espanola, for example).  The people who are calling for one today are merely attempting to marginalize the many foreign contributions to our culture, and the people who come from those non-Anglophone nations.

        If we REALLY wanted to restrict everyone to speaking the original AMERICAN language, we should quit using English and speak one of the Native American dialects (such as Cherokee, which has a writing system invented by one of their own, Sequoyah).

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