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View Diary: New Obama Foreign Policy Doctrine? F**k the EU? (62 comments)

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  •  The Legal Framework Is Important (1+ / 0-)
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    duhban

    The article you link and the studies it refers to basically only compare the legal framework for secret service internet surveillance operations in the US, the UK und Germany ... while this of course is a point of major importance, the legal findings here do not contradict anything I wrote above ...

    •  we will have to agree to disagree than (1+ / 0-)
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      GermanGuy

      Thank you for your time and discussion, you have a good day, Auf Wiedersehen

      Der Weg ist das Ziel

      by duhban on Sun Feb 09, 2014 at 01:57:43 AM PST

      [ Parent ]

      •  In the last European Parliament hearing, on (2+ / 0-)
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        stevemb, duhban

        the course of action in response to mass surveillance, the person who chaired the meeting reminded everyone after the first speaker, let's not single out the US. She pointed out that the draft resolution states that the national governments of the UK, France, Germany, and Sweden have agencies with the same practices. She added that Russia and China do, too. There's also the Five Eyes which extends to Australia and New Zealand.

        The EU's primary concern is to maintain mutual trust among its 28 members and to maintain mutual trust with external allies in North America.  

        It's important to understand that mutual trust is the foundation for the treaties and agreements that hold the EU together. The same goes for the Atlantic alliance. There's a level of fiduciary obligation among the parties to these treaties to protect each other in certain situations.

        The European Parliament's job is to restore the level of mutual trust among its members so that the organization is preserved and to obtain the cooperation of its North American partners to restore mutual trust with them as well.

        When I write, it's for an American audience, to explain the circle of mutual trust that encompasses the EU and the larger circle of trust that includes North America and the EU. Within that circle, the US and its partners still have obligations to each other. That's the focus of my writing.

        What Russia does, what China does, is outside our circle of mutual trust. We don't condone the spying they do and we understand that we don't have the kind of alliance with them that obligates mutual protection. The EU has no leverage to resolve surveillance issues with them comparable to the leverage it has within its own circle.

        I'm not a fan of Merkel and the problem we have goes beyond political personalities like Obama. The problem we have may be around after they are gone. The purpose of my writing would be clearer if I referred to countries instead. In that context, Germany may complain that the US is acting more like a country that's outside the circle, like Russia or China. And Germany, the UK, France, Sweden, and maybe one or two others are also doing their part to corrode mutual trust too.

        The European Parliament's plan encompasses all of this.

        There is no existence without doubt.

        by Mark Lippman on Sun Feb 09, 2014 at 05:20:31 AM PST

        [ Parent ]

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