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View Diary: (Trigger Alert) -- Woman Faces Murder Charges in Death of Rapist -- 20 Years After (15 comments)

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  •  No. (0+ / 0-)

    Victim never reported the rape to police, and soon afterwards, the rapist was dead.

    •  I was speaking in general. (4+ / 0-)

      She never went to the police. She was seriously molested by her father and the way she coped was to retreat into her own world. She tried to get help from her mother and the rest of her family, but they did nothing. So she learned that if you try and get help, people think you're making it up or you led him on. Do you know of one rapist who was pursued by the police with the same sort of vigor that they pursued her?

      "The cost of liberty is less than the price of repression." - W.E.B. Du Bois Be informed. Fight the Police State.

      by Eternal Hope on Thu Feb 13, 2014 at 03:07:43 PM PST

      [ Parent ]

      •  Not to be argumentative because I feel for this (3+ / 0-)
        Recommended by:
        IndieGuy, gustynpip, wilderness voice

        woman and what she's been through.  Been following it since it hit the news.  The Slate story was very detailed.  More than the media has portrayed.  However, yes there are cases of 20 year old rape cases being pursued.  Due to DNA.  20 year old rape case

        It's hard to imagine a jury of convicting her of murder based on what I've read.  Not sure why they pressed for the manslaughter charge. Seems to be some evidence that hasn't been revealed that may make her more culpable.  But even if she knew what was going to happen her mental condition at the time should be considered.  With out more evidence I would not convict.  

        If I comply with non-compliance am I complying?

        by thestructureguy on Thu Feb 13, 2014 at 03:24:45 PM PST

        [ Parent ]

        •  That's great. (1+ / 0-)
          Recommended by:
          BlackSheep1

          That's great that they can get convictions based on DNA evidence like that. I'd like to see if this particular police department that we're talking about is getting similar results against rapists using DNA. If they found DNA evidence that implicated her more than she was willing to let on, fine. I don't think any reasonable jury would acquit. But is still a fact that our society failed this person whether she is innocent or guilty.

          "The cost of liberty is less than the price of repression." - W.E.B. Du Bois Be informed. Fight the Police State.

          by Eternal Hope on Thu Feb 13, 2014 at 07:57:43 PM PST

          [ Parent ]

      •  You seem to be saying that rape is worse (0+ / 0-)

        than murder; that since the police don't pursue rapists for 20 years, they have no right to pursue murderers for that long a time, either.  

        None of us have any way of knowing what the actual facts of this case are.  It will be up to a jury to make that determination to the best of their ability.  This was a horrendous murder.  I can understand how a person could get caught up in this scenario, especially since it seems there were quite a few violent people surrounding this then young woman.  However, a jury has to determine whether she realized the man would be beaten once she identified him and whether her identification of him was forced (and I don't think it's necessary that she have known he'd be murdered.  If she knew a crime would be committed, she's responsible for it even if it ends up being worse than she anticipated.)

        I don't think some vague sense of fear for herself is sufficient.  I think it would have to have been some specific fear of immediate harm to herself to make it acceptable for her to assist in any way with another person being physically harmed, whether she'd previously been harmed or not.  Vigilantism is not okay, even when rape is involved.

        Then the fact that she refused to provide the information even after she knew there was no danger to herself does, I think, have to be taken into consideration because it casts doubt on the idea that she acted as she did out of fear.  Bad advice from a lawyer definitely doesn't cut it with that one.

        I don't know whether she shares any guilt.  But I certainly don't think it was somehow unfair to continue to work to bring to justice the killers of this man.  Nor do I think the effort was made because the detectives wanted to punish a rape victim further.  I think this is probably exactly the kind of case that calls for a jury of 12 people to hear as many of the facts that can be made available to them and make the best decision possible.  

        •  It's a matter of self-incrimination. (0+ / 0-)

          People have a right to avoid saying stuff that would incriminate them, and I don't think the cops have a right to use that silence against them. If the prosecutor actually offered her immunity in exchange for her testimony, then I would think differently. Most of us haven't experienced this, but it is clear from this that she had a deep distrust of cops, not without reason (this happened after Rodney King, for instance). If you're sexually abused as a child and nobody believes you when you raise your voice, it's easy for someone like her to mistrust the cops.

          I don't know whether she shares any guilt.  But I certainly don't think it was somehow unfair to continue to work to bring to justice the killers of this man.  Nor do I think the effort was made because the detectives wanted to punish a rape victim further.  I think this is probably exactly the kind of case that calls for a jury of 12 people to hear as many of the facts that can be made available to them and make the best decision possible.  
          I'm not saying that rape is worse than murder; I'm saying that there is just way too much misogynistic bias in our society based on this and many other cases where women try to stop sexual abuse or rape and nobody will help them. Obviously, the rapist in this case believed that he was not responsible for his actions because she (in his twisted worldview) led her on; that is a common belief in our society that the victim somehow was asking for it. What I am advocating is equal justice. If you're not pursing 20 year old rape cases with the same sort of determination that you are this case, then no reasonable person can argue that you, as a police organization or a prosecutor, are treating people equally and fairly. And furthermore, this tragedy never would have happened if our society had been there for this woman either while she was being abused by her father or after she was raped.

          Don't get me wrong; I'm not justifying vigilantism in this case. If she's guilty, she's guilty. But if we are to prevent future tragedies like this, then we have to be much more proactive.

          "The cost of liberty is less than the price of repression." - W.E.B. Du Bois Be informed. Fight the Police State.

          by Eternal Hope on Thu Feb 13, 2014 at 08:13:55 PM PST

          [ Parent ]

      •  Eternal Hope: Not a one (0+ / 0-)

        in fact I could name you some celebrated males accused of it.
        Assange.
        Polanski.
        Allen.
        Rothlisberger.
        Jameis Wilson.
        Bryant.

        None of them pursued on anything like this scale.
        Several women "paid off" in one way or another.
        Many of those men defended here on this site.

        LBJ, Van Cliburn, Ike, Wendy Davis, Lady Bird, Ann Richards, Barbara Jordan, Molly Ivins, Sully Sullenburger, Drew Brees: Texas is NO Bush League!

        by BlackSheep1 on Thu Feb 13, 2014 at 07:57:50 PM PST

        [ Parent ]

        •  Sadly: (1+ / 0-)
          Recommended by:
          BlackSheep1

          Some of these people couldn't get a fair trial here. They are such institutions that people would not want them to go to jail and they can hire the sort of high-powered lawyers who can blow holes wide open in police work and attorneys' cases. That just goes to show that our celebrity worship has gotten out of hand. There is always the temptation on the part of the celebrity to act with impunity because they think their lawyer can always get them off.

          "The cost of liberty is less than the price of repression." - W.E.B. Du Bois Be informed. Fight the Police State.

          by Eternal Hope on Thu Feb 13, 2014 at 08:25:53 PM PST

          [ Parent ]

          •  not just celebrities: remember the WS guy (0+ / 0-)

            who ran down a woman during a DUI and got no jail?

            Money makes the rules, dammit.

            LBJ, Van Cliburn, Ike, Wendy Davis, Lady Bird, Ann Richards, Barbara Jordan, Molly Ivins, Sully Sullenburger, Drew Brees: Texas is NO Bush League!

            by BlackSheep1 on Fri Feb 14, 2014 at 07:58:05 AM PST

            [ Parent ]

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