Skip to main content

View Diary: President Obama's New Budget To Limit Student Loan Forgiveness (46 comments)

Comment Preferences

  •  universities get paid; that explains tuition costs (0+ / 0-)

    period.

    Righteousness is a wide path. Self-righteousness is a bullhorn and a blindfold.

    by Murphoney on Fri Mar 07, 2014 at 12:11:54 PM PST

    [ Parent ]

    •  Yes. (0+ / 0-)

      Universities get paid because the government guarantees their loans. The government gets paid because it is exceptionally difficult to get a loan discharge in bankruptcy.

      That leaves the people who made poor decisions based on imperfect information footing the bill, often for the rest of their lives.

      I am all for putting the burden back on universities for charging outrageous tuition. Making life more difficult for those who are working in public interest jobs doesn't do anything to make the situation better though.

      •  leaving the situation at that and so letting the (0+ / 0-)

        universities off the hook, is certainly as short-term a thought as you were decrying elsewhere in the comments.

        Righteousness is a wide path. Self-righteousness is a bullhorn and a blindfold.

        by Murphoney on Fri Mar 07, 2014 at 12:47:19 PM PST

        [ Parent ]

        •  I'm not for letting universities off the hook. (0+ / 0-)

          Like I said "I am all for putting the burden back on universities for charging outrageous tuition." I don't think, however, that we should make student debtors's lives worse because the issue with rising tuition hasn't been dealt with.

          There are lots of problems with the way higher education was funded, and I didn't mean to suggest that this one little issue is a panacea. It's at best a stop gap, but that doesn't mean we should be OK with it.

          •  Blind perpetuation isn't anything... (1+ / 0-)
            Recommended by:
            orestes1963

            but participation.  It is condemning all the young people, today and especially tomorrow to a choice between indentured servitude and fraud.

            Continuing any level of funding that merely bolsters the ability of universities to increase their abuse of the current high-education/employment/income hostage crisis is a false dichotomy.

            Without reform efforts, the under-the-table public funding of higher education for the youth of families who cannot afford (or choose to avoid) the costs of attending universities that are outside their immediate means will  inevitably, eventually collapse.

            In the meantime, the corporate management of universities will collect the ransom.  and build bigger stadiums while cutting instructors' compensation.

            Righteousness is a wide path. Self-righteousness is a bullhorn and a blindfold.

            by Murphoney on Fri Mar 07, 2014 at 01:21:38 PM PST

            [ Parent ]

          •  The only way we're going to get (2+ / 0-)
            Recommended by:
            orestes1963, nextstep

            tuition down is to stop the spigot of free cash to students. If students don't care how much education costs (because someone else is paying for it), the schools will raise tuition. Consumers need to think long and hard before borrowing tens of thousands of dollars to fund an education. They will think about it more if they realize that they will have to eventually pay it all back. This is pretty simple economics, and is not an area of economic theory deemed controversial.

            •  Maybe you know different students than me. (0+ / 0-)

              I don't know any students who don't care about how much debt they are taking on. What I do know are lots of 18-20 year olds who have been (probably correctly) that the only way to get ahead in life is to get a college education. Having been fed that their whole lives, these 18-20 year olds make a decision to attend college without a full appreciation that they will be paying it off into their 40s or 50s.

              Their lack of appreciation of what it means to take on that much debt in connection with the inability to discharge student loans in bankruptcy leaves people stuck with loans they can't pay for much of their lives. Yes, it is clearly a poor financial decision; but we should not punish people for half their lives for a poor decision they make in their adolescence.

              •  Consider this: responsibility isn't punishment. (3+ / 0-)
                Recommended by:
                doc2, orestes1963, nextstep

                They are either not adults, in which case this is their parents' doing, or they are adults.

                Moreover (and again) allowing these young people to have to make this decision isn't a neutral decision.  Choosing the status quo is, in fact, propping up the establishment that sets the astronomical prices.

                Righteousness is a wide path. Self-righteousness is a bullhorn and a blindfold.

                by Murphoney on Fri Mar 07, 2014 at 02:20:39 PM PST

                [ Parent ]

                •  What is your solution? (0+ / 0-)

                  From what I see, you want to cut the government out of the loan guarantee game. This would (presumably) result in fewer loans being made with the result of fewer students attending college if their parents couldn't fund it. The reduced supply of students would then force colleges to reduce their tuition prices to be able to compete. Is that your reasoning?

                  •  Your strawman neglects the obvious. (1+ / 0-)
                    Recommended by:
                    doc2

                    There are lower-cost options for higher education.

                    If you wish to prop up 4-year tuition rates that rival the cost of a home, and their continuous, astronomical trajectory, I am not interested.

                    But I don't think you should complain about anyone else's about short-term thinking.

                    Righteousness is a wide path. Self-righteousness is a bullhorn and a blindfold.

                    by Murphoney on Fri Mar 07, 2014 at 02:39:04 PM PST

                    [ Parent ]

Subscribe or Donate to support Daily Kos.

Click here for the mobile view of the site