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View Diary: A Muslim Atheist in America (80 comments)

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  •  Then I would say they are uwittingly (0+ / 0-)

    adding to the problem.  To insist on conflating a system of beliefs, which are something a person is capable of altering, to a race or ethnic upbringing, which is not alterable, is to confuse that which a person chooses with that which a person has no choice over.

    You can choose your religion in a way you can't choose your race or gender or ethnicity.

    •  No and yes. (1+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      arodb

      Many religions have such a strong culture that it is also not truly alterable.  I was raised Catholic and I understand Catholics.  After over 30 years have passed since I left the church, and becoming essentially an open-minded atheist, I am still defined in a very significant way as a Catholic.  I cannot alter that and I have tried, very seriously tried.

      You are right that you cannot choose your race or gender, but religion is not as wearable as you seem to believe.

      America, where a rising tide lifts all boats! Unless you don't have a boat...uh...then it lifts all who can swim! Er, uh...um...and if you can't swim? SHAME ON YOU!

      by Back In Blue on Fri Mar 14, 2014 at 09:32:41 PM PDT

      [ Parent ]

      •  But you're not helping matters if you (1+ / 0-)
        Recommended by:
        arodb

        were to call yourself, currently, a Catholic.  Which you didn't.  You phrased it correctly, as "was raised Catholic".  It's the "am currently Catholic" that's incorrect.  Saying you have leftover aftereffects from an upbringing in a religion is not the same thing as claiming you are still a member of it.

        •  Ugh. There is NO CORRECT WAY to describe yourself (0+ / 0-)

          Only stupid, bigoted people say things like "once a [insert religion] always a [etc.]".  They are the ones who have to get over it, not people who feel that their religious history is essential to who they are even if they are not practicing.

          I still struggle to this day to describe what I believe in a nice tidy soundbite.  I HAVE called myself a Catholic atheist.  I've also called myself just atheist, agnostic, Recovering Catholic, and other much shorter lived ideas.  I got pushback on everything, including saying I was "raised Catholic" (to which the counter was always "once a Catholic always a Catholic."

          So I realized that it's not MY problem what others think about me or what box they want to put me in.  I say whatever I feel on any particular day or moment because that's the best I can offer.  Don't like it? Too bad.  It's not MY problem if others can't deal—that's their problem.

          What really doesn't help matters is trying to accommodate stupid, bigoted, narrow-minded, assholes trying to put everyone in a bucket or find some other way to discriminate against them.  

          What does help is to not accept those labels or put yourself in a bucket and perpetuate their bigotry.

          America, where a rising tide lifts all boats! Unless you don't have a boat...uh...then it lifts all who can swim! Er, uh...um...and if you can't swim? SHAME ON YOU!

          by Back In Blue on Sat Mar 15, 2014 at 10:42:07 PM PDT

          [ Parent ]

          •  I am a 30 meter tall Martian cyclops. (0+ / 0-)

            Either you:
            (A) agree with that utterly ridiculous statement, or
            (B) admit that your premise that it's totally honest for any person to label themselves with whatever words they feel like in utter contradiction to how those words are used by the rest of the population is false, and you know it.

            By pretending that a word that describes a set of beliefs and practices is an accurate label of you when you don't believe those things anymore and no longer follow those practices, is just perpetuating the bigoted notion that religion is inborn.

            •  Well, I guess you're one of those assholes. (0+ / 0-)

              (A) You accept it when I use the Steven Mading approved label "raised Catholic."

              (B) You do not accept it when I say anything else.

              Conclusion: YOUR THE BIGOT.

              America, where a rising tide lifts all boats! Unless you don't have a boat...uh...then it lifts all who can swim! Er, uh...um...and if you can't swim? SHAME ON YOU!

              by Back In Blue on Sun Mar 16, 2014 at 09:10:25 PM PDT

              [ Parent ]

              •  I don't own any "the bigot", (0+ / 0-)

                so I have no idea what this thing is you're talking about with the phrase "your the bigot".  I don't have any the bigots.

                And the fact that to make your point you have to lie by pretending you think I'm the only person in the world who knows that stating you are a catholic means by definition that you are currently a follower of the religion does not help your point.  You know perfectly well that that's what it actually means to say you're a member of a religion.  

                Can you make your point without lying this time?

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