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View Diary: The Science of Bisexuality (206 comments)

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  •  Are you saying the majority of Ancient Greek upper (0+ / 0-)

    class men were gay in our modern sense?

    yeah, right.

    •  It's always been my impression... (5+ / 0-)

      that while ancient Greek society viewed a sexual relationship between an adult male and an ephebe as a rite of passage for the ephebe, acceptance of sexual and/or romantic relationships between two adult males varied greatly and was more the exception than the rule. At the same time, lack of acceptance of such, unlike in our own culture, was reflected mainly by way of disdain rather than by way of moral condemnation and prosecution. And for that reason "lack of acceptance" was more relative than absolute. It was not viewed as ideal but it was most certainly tolerated.

      I seem to recall having read that in contrast to Socrates, who was mainly heterosexual and who was married to a woman, his prize pupil Plato who memorialized him by composing the many dialogs of which Socrates is the star (including most importantly for current purposes The Symposium which touches on, among other things, the topic of male beauty), was most likely entirely homosexual. This did not prevent him from having a great deal of success as an academician.

      •  My understanding is this: "Gay" sex was pretty (1+ / 0-)
        Recommended by:


        Male/male love was too.  But it doesn't seem the rules of that love match very well with how we think of love.

        Male love for women was suspicious, though there was a lot of pressure to marry.

        But at least for the upper classes, and based only upon the records we have, there seems to have been advice about the correct posture:  doggy style.  In part so as not to confuse marital love with the type of love appropriate with male/male love.

        Which, however, should be different than marital love :)

        Correct sexual posture for men was also described:  spooning, with the older male spooning the younger.

        It was considered very bad for the younger to spoon the older.

        But, again, we don't have a lot of records.

        And none in regard to the lower classes.

        Some speculate that homosexuality was revered only for the educated upper classes  --  based on snippets.

      •  In a weird way, we've gone backwards... (1+ / 0-)
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        Bob Love

        for lack of a better term.  In modern society,  sex between two adult males is acceptable but an older male with a teenage boy is absolutely verboten.

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