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View Diary: Anarchy Looms in Ukraine as 30,000 Russian Troops Massed Just Across Border (64 comments)

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  •  That's exactly what she's trying to do. (0+ / 0-)

    Drag us into a war in which we have no business getting into. She can put whatever spin she want to on her remarks and call it metaphor, but the fact that she said even the stuff she admits to saying means that she wants war. Obviously, Ukraine doesn't have nukes, but she is making the same mistake that Georgia made when they thought we would come to their aid and that Serbia made when they thought Russia would come to their aid.

    "The cost of liberty is less than the price of repression." - W.E.B. Du Bois Be informed. Fight the Police State.

    by Eternal Hope on Thu Mar 27, 2014 at 07:44:24 PM PDT

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    •  Dearie (0+ / 0-)

      Ukraine already IS at war in case you hadn't noticed. She has been around and seen the US limp response. She knows no one is coming to help.  I guess it is too hard for your to comprehend that she's probably really pissed at being invaded again by a country that previously killed tens of millions and is expressing that in a private conversation in what may be a doctored tape. Of course, propagandists bend over backwards to make Ukrainians look like uncivilized barbarians.

      •  How do you know the tape was doctored? (0+ / 0-)

        "The cost of liberty is less than the price of repression." - W.E.B. Du Bois Be informed. Fight the Police State.

        by Eternal Hope on Fri Mar 28, 2014 at 04:40:28 AM PDT

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        •  I thought you had said so (0+ / 0-)

          Perhaps I misunderstood you

          Frankly it doesn't matter. Even if authentic you are reading tea leaves and bending over backwards to out words in her mouth.

          •  I said "if" for the sake of the argument. (0+ / 0-)

            I don't know one way or the other. You can rationalize it all you want to, but it won't change the reality that what she said was inflammatory and won't do anything to help create peace or stability in the region and will likely serve only to bait the Russians.

            "The cost of liberty is less than the price of repression." - W.E.B. Du Bois Be informed. Fight the Police State.

            by Eternal Hope on Fri Mar 28, 2014 at 11:46:20 AM PDT

            [ Parent ]

            •  now that's fair (0+ / 0-)

              I misunderstood you.

              Sure, it's probably inflammatory, although it wouldn't have been if her private call hadn't been tapped and broadcast (by whom, I wonder).  One of the problems with invading your neighbors is that it tends to provoke responses that don't create peace or stability.  While I agree it is probably not the most productive response, it sure is entirely understandable. It would be quite unfair to cast that as somehow blameworthy, under the circumstances, really. I think there were a lot of similar expressions about Al Qaeda by US politicians after 9/11 also, for example.

              As for baiting the Russians, Putin's government is self-baiting. It has proven itself entirely capable of trumping up whatever excuse in order to take whatever it wants by force.  I think this notion that outsiders have significant leverage, either positive or negative, on Putin's actions is fairly wrong headed.  Putin will choose to invade or not depending on what he believes he can do and what is in his interest to do, based on both domestic political considerations and foreign geopolitical ones.  If he thinks that he can get away with annexing all of Ukraine and sees benefit in it, he will, regardless of what some politician in Ukraine does or does not say.  Not being inflammatory sure isn't going to stop him, and being inflammatory isn't going to goad him into doing something he wasn't going to do anyway.

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