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View Diary: Is Marine Le Pen a Fascist and a Fraud? French Courts Say “Oui!” (34 comments)

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  •  Many years ago I read an essay (6+ / 0-)

    about the problems faced by Canada. It came to the conclusion that in it history the country had been exposed to British politics, American knowhow and French culture. Somehow they managed to acquire British knowhow, American culture and French politics.

    •  I think there are variations on that theme but I (4+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      poco, Richard Lyon, commonmass, koNko

      doubt I could recite them the way they're intended.

      I like French politics. People got into that municipal election more than March Madness brackets.

      Le Pen & Mélenchon are funny together if you can overlook her fascist roots.

      •  I have gotten plugged into UK politics (4+ / 0-)
        Recommended by:
        Mark Lippman, commonmass, BMScott, koNko

        to be able to grasp it at something of a gut level because I can participate in online discussions. My French is almost non existent. When it is all filtered through English language media French politics sounds like farce. I'm sure if one could get up close and personal with it, it would take on more depth.

        I'm presently reading a biography of Voltaire.

        •  It's not all that different from the US. (4+ / 0-)
          Recommended by:
          commonmass, BMScott, koNko, poco

          The current political issues are pretty similar. The system is similar. You can see from Voltaire that the US founders got their ideals and principles from France. I don't think Americans like to acknowledge that the Bill of Rights didn't grow out of the dirt in Massachusetts or Virginia.

          •  Voltaire and Montesquieu both (0+ / 0-)

            were heavily influenced by long stays in England and their parliamentary system. The "free born Englishman" is part of the national identity and it has its roots in the Great Charter. Many of the ideas in our Bill of Rights have their origins in English common law. So it is not from France, but from England that the ideals and principles originated. Of course, they were added to by the Philosophes and popularized during the Enlightenment.

            You can wake someone who is sleeping, but you cannot wake someone who is pretending to sleep.

            by gnothis on Mon Apr 14, 2014 at 07:03:03 PM PDT

            [ Parent ]

            •  Of course English common law. A mother country (2+ / 0-)
              Recommended by:
              poco, gnothis

              and father country are both possible, don't you agree?

              •  Independence would have (2+ / 0-)
                Recommended by:
                poco, Mark Lippman

                been a hell of a lot harder without those Frenchies. Just to be clear--I did not mean to minimize the impact of French Enlightenment thinkers, just to complicate it a bit. To this day the UK does not have a written bill of rights, or a written constitution for that matter.

                You can wake someone who is sleeping, but you cannot wake someone who is pretending to sleep.

                by gnothis on Mon Apr 14, 2014 at 07:52:41 PM PDT

                [ Parent ]

                •  Amazing. I didn't know that. How did I miss that? (0+ / 0-)

                  No constitution? Do they get by on politeness and courtesy?

                  •  Been a crazy week--sorry about the late reply. (0+ / 0-)

                    The 'constitution' is all based on precedent and common law. Walter Bagehot's famous The English Constitution, published in 1867 as the UK was broadening the franchise, is still a great primer on the collection of statutes, court judgments, and treaties that make up the 'unwritten' constitution of the UK. There have been attempts to get a written bill of rights enacted, but no luck yet. I believe there is a Commission on the Bill of Rights in Parliament right now, but historically commissions have been used to delay action, let passions simmer down, and then do nothing but issue a report.

                    You can wake someone who is sleeping, but you cannot wake someone who is pretending to sleep.

                    by gnothis on Thu Apr 17, 2014 at 02:54:57 PM PDT

                    [ Parent ]

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