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View Diary: NYT retracts claims of presence of Russian forces in Eastern Ukraine (84 comments)

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  •  NYT is a propaganda outfit. (9+ / 0-)

    Does anyone care to remember the role the New York Times played in legitimizing the over-the-top claims from the Bush administration as it steamrolled us into Iraq? Or more recently, its advocacy of intervention in the Syrian civil war & the atrocity stories that accompanied it? With regard to the Ukraine crisis, it seems curious as to why it devotes so much space to "refuting" the version of events presented in Russian media. Above all else, the Ukraine crisis is a propaganda war, & the NYT is enthusiastically doing its part for the U.S. side, day after day, story after story. Under the rules by which American media operate, there's no need to fact-check when the objective is to demonize America's adversaries.

    •  Halliburton come up short this fiscal year? (4+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      CIndyCasella, corvo, Sunspots, Sandino

      And where is Judith Miller when you really need her?

      Rose Schneiderman (1866-1972). "The life of men and women is so cheap and property is so sacred."

      by lyvwyr101 on Wed Apr 23, 2014 at 11:44:27 AM PDT

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    •  You've got to be kidding (4+ / 0-)
      it seems curious as to why it devotes so much space to "refuting" the version of events presented in Russian media.
      Anyone who thinks there is any sort of parity between the NYTimes and the Russian media is a moron.

      "Well, I'm sure I'd feel much worse if I weren't under such heavy sedation..."--David St. Hubbins

      by Old Left Good Left on Wed Apr 23, 2014 at 11:49:54 AM PDT

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      •  When it comes to reporting on foreign conflicts (3+ / 0-)
        Recommended by:
        Sunspots, callmecassandra, Sandino

        U.S. corporate media have repeatedly shown themselves to be scarcely more "truthful" than Russian "state" media.

        A few years ago a Russian coworker of mine explained this difference between Russians & Americans. Russians, he said,  watch their TV news & know it's propaganda, while Americans watch their TV news & accept is as objective truth.

        I don't consume enough Russian media to be able to make any assessment about parity, but I have been reading the NYT long enough to understand its propagandistic bent. The series of articles it has run with regard to the Ukraine crisis certainly fall under the rubric of propaganda, while some of them could be considered outright fiction. And there's enough recent history to understand that in its reporting on international affairs, the NYT is effectively a mouthpiece for the U.S. side.  

        •  Bullshit (0+ / 0-)
          U.S. corporate media have repeatedly shown themselves to be scarcely more "truthful" than Russian "state" media.
          Anyone who believes that is a moron.

          "Well, I'm sure I'd feel much worse if I weren't under such heavy sedation..."--David St. Hubbins

          by Old Left Good Left on Wed Apr 23, 2014 at 01:34:19 PM PDT

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          •  Gee, a cuss word & an ad hominem attack. (1+ / 0-)
            Recommended by:
            Sandino

            Must've struck a nerve or something. But on the subject of BS, that would be the assumption that our side reports objective truth while the other side reports nothing but propaganda. To believe this, one must have awakened from a sleep of 20 or so years.

            •  People like the U.S. being number one. I don't (1+ / 0-)
              Recommended by:
              Sandino

              know why some don't embrace the fact that the U.S. media is number one in propaganda.
              It's like an honor isn't it?

              "Fragmented and confused, we have no plan to combat any of this, but are looking to be saved by the very architects of our ruination."

              by BigAlinWashSt on Wed Apr 23, 2014 at 02:03:04 PM PDT

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              •  Can you spot the difference? (3+ / 0-)

                I didn't claim that the US media is wholly objective nor that it is entirely free from propaganda.

                However the claim that the NY Times is "scarcely more 'truthful'" than Russian media is patently ridiculous.

                "Well, I'm sure I'd feel much worse if I weren't under such heavy sedation..."--David St. Hubbins

                by Old Left Good Left on Wed Apr 23, 2014 at 03:17:47 PM PDT

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                •  I'd say it's the same thing only different. (1+ / 0-)
                  Recommended by:
                  Sandino

                  I've been to communist countries before the Wall fell and saw that type of propaganda.  Just blatant brainwashing and state subservience.  
                  The western method is different but just as effective.  Going back to before WWI, the buildup to that can be seen in the book, Preachers Present Arms by Ray Abrams. Then we had Edward Bernays who wrote the book, "Propaganda".  
                  The NYT is notorious and is owned by the super rich that control us all.  It mixes truth with the agenda of the ruling class.
                  It's really hard nowadays with the internet thrown in the mix.  The only answer is to educate oneself sufficiently to be able to draw your own conclusions.  

                  "Fragmented and confused, we have no plan to combat any of this, but are looking to be saved by the very architects of our ruination."

                  by BigAlinWashSt on Wed Apr 23, 2014 at 03:36:49 PM PDT

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            •  Oh, do you believe the things you write? (0+ / 0-)

              You're creating a strawman.  I didn't say the NYTimes (which isn't "our" side, it's a newspaper) always reports "objective truth" (whatever that is supposed to mean") or that Russian media only reports "propaganda."

              There is a very large difference in the reliability of the NYTimes, on the one hand, and that of Russian media.  And, anyone who believes that there is "scarcely" any difference between them is a moron.

              "Well, I'm sure I'd feel much worse if I weren't under such heavy sedation..."--David St. Hubbins

              by Old Left Good Left on Wed Apr 23, 2014 at 03:29:09 PM PDT

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          •  Please abide community standards (1+ / 0-)
            Recommended by:
            Sandino

            Make your case using facts and links. Leave your insults outside the DK community.

            •  You really think that Russian state media (0+ / 0-)

              is equivalent to the NY Times?  That is the extraordinary claim, and someone who makes it is the one who has the burden of proof.

              "Well, I'm sure I'd feel much worse if I weren't under such heavy sedation..."--David St. Hubbins

              by Old Left Good Left on Wed Apr 23, 2014 at 04:52:06 PM PDT

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            •  And, by the way... (0+ / 0-)

              I did not insult anyone.  I insulted a ridiculous belief, which is well within the community standards.  But thank you for your concern.

              "Well, I'm sure I'd feel much worse if I weren't under such heavy sedation..."--David St. Hubbins

              by Old Left Good Left on Wed Apr 23, 2014 at 04:53:50 PM PDT

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              •  Calling people morons is not debate (1+ / 0-)
                Recommended by:
                Sandino

                It is a violation of community standards.

                •  Whatever (0+ / 0-)

                  By the way, your diary title is wrong.

                  "Well, I'm sure I'd feel much worse if I weren't under such heavy sedation..."--David St. Hubbins

                  by Old Left Good Left on Wed Apr 23, 2014 at 08:05:32 PM PDT

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                  •  In what way? (0+ / 0-)

                    The New York Times has now stated that we should no longer rely on the photographs on which it based its confident claim that Russian troops were in effect leading the Eastern Ukrainian rebellion.  

                    Retracting evidence amounts to retracting any claims based on that evidence-- even if The New York Times waits years to officially admit that it screwed up.

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