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View Diary: Did the Colorado Recall Doom Gun Control? (323 comments)

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  •  Susan I work to get out the Democratic vote in CO (6+ / 0-)

    Your post reads to me more like an attempt to argue gun politics on DK than an honest examination of the gun issue on Colorado politics. The two are very different matters.

    DK is not the real world. Ballots cast by Democrats to recall sitting Democratic state senators are. It happened. Without Dems voting to recall it wouldn't have happened.

    I talk often with my county Democratic organisers about mobilizing volunteers to help GOTV in the upcoming elections. I can't ever recall anything ever being said about guns. Nothing. Not pro or con. Fracking, water, education, transportation, marriage equality, all issues we discuss. Guns? I've never heard the word spoken.

    I've often heard the expression "gun nuts", there is also a similar group I'll call "anti gun nuts". Either one can be very harmful to Democratic chances in what is shaping up to be an extremely close election.

    “Conservation… is a positive exercise of skill and insight, not merely a negative exercise of abstinence and caution…” Aldo Leopold

    by ban nock on Tue Apr 29, 2014 at 06:02:33 AM PDT

    •  The Colo state GOP voted for gun control yesterday (5+ / 0-)

      ... I don't think even the GOP fears the gun extremists in Colorado:

      https://www.facebook.com/...

      "Looking back over a lifetime, you see that love was the answer to everything." — Ray Bradbury

      by We Shall Overcome on Tue Apr 29, 2014 at 06:34:15 AM PDT

      [ Parent ]

    •  and where are the independent voter numbers at? (3+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      ban nock, Wordsinthewind, buddabelly

      they are what determines colorado elections. not dems and not gopers.

      as much as people try to explain it away, gun control is a losing issue here. they'll see.

      The whole problem with the world is that fools and fanatics are always so certain of themselves, but wiser people so full of doubts. -Bertrand Russell

      by elkhunter on Tue Apr 29, 2014 at 06:46:39 AM PDT

      [ Parent ]

      •  Good question. I will add them into the diary. (4+ / 0-)

        As for "gun control" the word has become so toxic that it is no longer usable in polite company.

        However, universal background checks and limits on magazine capacity are far more acceptable to Coloradans.

        •  magazine capacity is a loser, and for UBC (1+ / 0-)
          Recommended by:
          ban nock

          the devil is in the details....everyone is for better background cks in principle, what does that mean in the context of medical records privacy?

          Does every person who ever took any antidepressant or mood stabilizer or even anti-psychotic become a prohibited possessor? Because I know people prescribed Trazadone, an antipsychotic for a sleeping pill....What about ADHD meds, or seizure meds or....can you see why some of us consider this a slippery slope?

          Is it only involuntary commitment like now only with actual reporting to nics so people like Cho don't fall through the chasms (fuck cracks, they got bigger than that long ago) or does now voluntary count against you?  What about court ordered outpatient programs...should these people be prohibited via blanket use of "mental illness" when many with mental illness if not the great majority are no more capable of hurting another than the average American......

          This really isn't a subject with easy answers or it would be over.....

          Vaya con Dios Don Alejo
          I want to die a slave to principles. Not to men.
          Emiliano Zapata

          by buddabelly on Tue Apr 29, 2014 at 02:47:17 PM PDT

          [ Parent ]

          •  It needs to be addressed (0+ / 0-)

            And can be while maintaining medical privacy. If a doctor prescribes a medication which can cause an impairment, that person shouldn't be in possession of guns.

            Since trazodone may impair the mental and/or physical abilities required for performance of potentially hazardous tasks, such as operating an automobile or machinery, the patient should be cautioned not to engage in such activities while impaired.
            If you're on trazodone, you shouldn't be near a gun. It would be irresponsible.

            KOS: "Mocking partisans focusing on elections? Even less reason to be on Daily Kos."

            by fcvaguy on Tue Apr 29, 2014 at 05:02:08 PM PDT

            [ Parent ]

      •  very recent Q poll (2+ / 0-)
        Recommended by:
        ban nock, Susan from 29
        39. Do you support or oppose the stricter new gun control laws in Colorado?

                         Tot    Rep     Dem     Ind     Men    Wom    

        Support    39%    12%    74%    38%    29%    49%    
        Oppose       56     84        21       58      67       46  
        DK/NA          5      5           6        4         4        5      
         AGE IN YRS..............
                         18-29  30-49  50-64  65+
             support 40%    33%    45%    42
             oppose  55       63       52       51

        TREND: Do you support or oppose the stricter new gun control laws in Colorado?

                             Apr 23  Feb 05  Nov 19  Aug 22
                             2014    2014     2013      2013

        Support              39      43       40           40
        Oppose               56      52       55           54
        DK/NA                  5        5         4             5

        40. Do you support or oppose requiring background checks for all gun buyers?

                                  Tot    Rep    Dem    Ind      Men     wom  

        Support              85%    75%    97%    85%    78%   91%  
        Oppose               14       23        2       14        20      8    
        DK/NA                 1         2         1         1          1      2    

         AGE IN YRS....     18-29  30-49   50-64  65+
        support                89%    84%    84%    83%
        oppose                 10       15       14       13
        DK/NA                    1         1         1        4

        TREND: Do you support or oppose requiring background checks for all gun buyers?

                             Apr 23  Feb 05  Nov 19  Aug 22
                             2014    2014    2013    2013

        Support              85      86      85      82
        Oppose               14      13      14      16
        DK/NA                  1        1        1        2

        41. Do you support or oppose a statewide ban on the sale of high-capacity ammunition magazines that hold more than 15 bullets?

                                  Tot    Rep    Dem      Ind      Men   Wom    

        Support              45%    24%    75%   41%    36%   54%  
        Oppose               51       72       21      54        62     40  
        DK/NA                 4          4        4         4         2       6    

             AGE IN YRS..............
        t                18-29  30-49  50-64  65+
        support        42%    38%    51%    51%
        oppose         49       59       46       46        
        DK/NA            9        3         3         3

        TREND: Do you support or oppose a statewide ban on the sale of high-capacity ammunition magazines that hold more than 15 bullets?

                             Apr 23  Feb 05  Nov 19  Aug 22
                             2014    2014    2013    2013

        Support              45      50      49      49
        Oppose               51      47      48      48
        DK/NA                 4       3       3       3
         

        This is from a Q poll from the 23rd of this month
        Seems to me it shows indies are against more useless gun control but support a better background ck system like most everyone else.

        Man it sucks getting tables to properly display when you have zero knowledge of html......at least it came out kinda legible....we'll see what happens when actually posted....

        And as far as I can tell, the "gun control" just passed is all on mental health...something that no one is against in theory but the practice is where the problems, if any, will arise......

        Vaya con Dios Don Alejo
        I want to die a slave to principles. Not to men.
        Emiliano Zapata

        by buddabelly on Tue Apr 29, 2014 at 02:06:55 PM PDT

        [ Parent ]

        •  It is a pain in the butt to do tables. I have to (3+ / 0-)
          Recommended by:
          buddabelly, FogCityJohn, ban nock

          refer to a New Diarist diary every time I want to try to add one. And I took classes in html coding back when that was the only tool for web design.

          The polling results haven't changed a lot from the November poll which I used because a) it came up first on the google search and b) it was taken shortly after the recall election and included a question on the recall itself.

          The problem with the mental health issue, IMO is that we no longer have the support system to care for those who need the care. We abandoned mental health care in California when Reagan was governor, sending those who needed help to a life on the streets. Where we, of course, criticize them for not picking themselves up by their bootstraps and getting a job and health care.

          So many of our problems are interrelated that it is difficult to only address one specific angle of the issue.

          But, just because it is difficult doesn't mean we shouldn't try.

      •  whoops, link to Q poll (2+ / 0-)
        Recommended by:
        ban nock, Susan from 29

        Vaya con Dios Don Alejo
        I want to die a slave to principles. Not to men.
        Emiliano Zapata

        by buddabelly on Tue Apr 29, 2014 at 02:07:33 PM PDT

        [ Parent ]

    •  Actually, it was a response to an argument that (6+ / 0-)

      appears here at DK on a regular basis. That argument is that "gun control" will doom the Democratic Party at the polls. The argument was based solely on the results of the Colorado recall.

      So I dug around to find out what the numbers were. What I found clearly refutes the argument, as does your comment.

      I am neither a gun nut nor an anti-gun nut. Unless agreeing that we need sane gun safety laws makes me one or the other.

      I have no problem with hunters and target shooters. I am actually a very good shot myself. But I do get weary of being told that I have no right to object to the appearance of weapons in arena's in which they have no conceivable purpose but to intimidate or harm others. Such as a public park during a little league game.

      I support universal background checks, a limit on magazine capacity and the regulation of certain semi-automatic assault weapons as was done under the Assault Weapons Ban of 1994, which, btw, withstood multiple court challenges.

      •  I've never heard anyone say gun control will (0+ / 0-)

        "doom" the Dems but it no doubt hurts us, and in some instances such as my state's recalls it has hurt us a lot. No one disagrees with background checks, those are people control. Mag restrictions are gun control.

        21% of Dems and 54% of Indies oppose, and that's in CO in total, not a congressional district. That's enough to lose us the senate seat that is tight, plus the governors mansion.

        I see no way to make up become down or black become white. When Dems recall Dems, and say they don't' support gun control via mag restrictions it's a loser at the pols. Not "doom",  but a loser. It's been proven here in CO.

        Saying you are ok with hunting or target shooting is like saying you are pro choice when it's rape or incest.

        “Conservation… is a positive exercise of skill and insight, not merely a negative exercise of abstinence and caution…” Aldo Leopold

        by ban nock on Tue Apr 29, 2014 at 07:29:55 PM PDT

        [ Parent ]

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