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View Diary: Louisville principal protects rights of transgender freshman (22 comments)

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  •  Amazing principal. We could use more like that. (3+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    rserven, VeggiElaine, cotterperson

    On the subject of rest rooms --
    I've been thinking that a solution to many restroom issues is to make all restrooms gender neutral. I know this would take massive amounts of money and remodeling, but it could be done over time as public restrooms came up for needed renovations.
    The idea would be that all public rest rooms would have a general sink area for everyone, a set of stalls, and perhaps a separate area behind a wall with urinals.
    The reason for this is not so much to placate people like the gripey parents mentioned in your diary but to:
    1) solve the problem for someone just beginning to deal with gender issues, or someone like a guy I know who, because of the breasts he was born with, looks female to other people.
    2) in just about every venue, there are long long lines for the women's restrooms while the men's rooms have no line at all. If the two separate restrooms were combined into one large one (with a separate area for urinals), things might balance out much better.
    3) this would also help parents -- you're a father out with your 6 year old daughter; you don't want to send her into the women's room by herself but you also don't want to take her into the men's room. If restrooms were unisex but with stalls, this wouldn't be a problem.

    While Democrats work to get more people to vote, Republicans work to ensure those votes won't count.

    by Tamar on Sat May 17, 2014 at 02:42:31 PM PDT

    •  As long as it's not establishment of gender... (6+ / 0-)

      ...neutral bathrooms that transpeople have to use...apart from gendered bathrooms.  As the Maine pediatrician sand psychologists testified, a large portion of gender socialization occurs in restrooms...and that is also a part of education.

      •  that's why I was thinking ALL public restrooms (3+ / 0-)
        Recommended by:
        rserven, VeggiElaine, cotterperson

        should be gender neutral. There are also people who really don't accept being a particular gender at all.
        I think family restrooms are still needed for people who need assistance or for families with a few small children who need a big enough space to all be together.

        While Democrats work to get more people to vote, Republicans work to ensure those votes won't count.

        by Tamar on Sat May 17, 2014 at 03:31:34 PM PDT

        [ Parent ]

    •  except (2+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      VeggiElaine, rserven

      ...it isn't going to happen.  It will surely get more common to have gender neutral bathrooms, for the reasons you mention, but it will never be complete.   I totally agree that women's bathrooms are overcrowded and long lines to pee should not be our lot.  But as a trans woman I gotta say...positing a someday solution requiring remodeling is kind of infuriating.

      The solution to this is simply, don't be a jerk and don't let other people be jerks.  Really.  That's it!  I've spent nigh twenty years being afraid every time I have to pee, and while I hate this more than I can say or you will ever know, I don't think this is a terribly important issue as  such.

      When I read the item above I wonder whether this chica will ever get to grow up and exactly how it will be for her finding a job and getting medical care and renting an apartment.  In Kentucky if she can't get out.  The bathroom issue is just the bloody flag these people wave, but -- though I have had people offer to relieve me of the burden of breathing for taking a piss -- the ways they kill us and convince us we are nothing go so far beyond this that it is basically a dog whistle.  The solution to racism isn't finding Obama's birth certificate, and the solution to our daily ruin is not gender neutral bathrooms.

      Sorry.  Bad day.

      ...j'ai découvert que tout le malheur des hommes vient d'une seule chose, qui est de ne savoir pas demeurer en repos dans une chambre.

      by jessical on Sat May 17, 2014 at 04:05:36 PM PDT

      [ Parent ]

      •  I wasn't suggesting this instead of what should be (3+ / 0-)
        Recommended by:
        rserven, jessical, cotterperson

        done now -- I was thinking for the future.
        For now, I'm strongly in favor of protecting the rights of transgender people and I certainly don't buy into the crap about how "dangerous" it is to have a transgender woman use the women's restrooms.
        However, if you think about the cutouts now on so many sidewalk corners, it wasn't all that long ago when there were absolutely none. Over time, these became pretty standard. And people discovered that not only are these cutouts good for people in wheel chairs or with other mobility problems, they are also good for strollers and bikes and wheeled carts -- they help many many more people than those for whom they were originally intended.
        I feel the same way about bathrooms. If they started being built that way in new buildings, particularly places like stadiums, or like fairgrounds (where I waited in a very long line for the ladies' just a few weeks ago), I think they'd become very popular and would end up being created when old restrooms were renovated.
        I guess I'm more optimistic about this than you are, probably because I haven't had to deal with the issues you have. (OTOH, I had a severely disabled son and dealt with all kinds of barriers and accessibility problems. My anger at being faced with steps to get into a building I was told would be accessible and in which my son had an appointment probably matches your anger very nicely).

        While Democrats work to get more people to vote, Republicans work to ensure those votes won't count.

        by Tamar on Sat May 17, 2014 at 04:32:53 PM PDT

        [ Parent ]

    •  Gender-neutral restrooms ... (2+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      rserven, VeggiElaine

      IRRC -- and I very well may not, isn't that the way it is in at least some European countries? That's a decades-old memory that may be meaningless.

      Reality check anyone?

      "Let each unique song be sung and the spell of differentiation be broken" - Winter Rabbit

      by cotterperson on Sat May 17, 2014 at 06:03:48 PM PDT

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      •  I didn't see any, but at least in France they (2+ / 0-)
        Recommended by:
        rserven, cotterperson

        seemed looser about who goes where.
        When we went to France 35+ years ago, the restrooms were  spotless. Each one had an attendant that you would tip, and she (it was always a she) would give you a nice clean towel.
        When we went about 10 years ago, the restrooms were filthy, absolutely disgusting. No attendant.

        While Democrats work to get more people to vote, Republicans work to ensure those votes won't count.

        by Tamar on Sat May 17, 2014 at 06:50:08 PM PDT

        [ Parent ]

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