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View Diary: Pennsylvania house approves 'In God We Trust' motto for schools (119 comments)

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  •  How many women has the Catholic church (4+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    skrekk, cai, gffish, jessbell911

    killed because they won't allow abortions, even in cases of rape, incest or the life of the mother. I know of a couple of famous cases in just the last few years. But do go on about how religious extremism is only for "other religions". Or how about when the Catholic and Mormon churches worked together to pass Prop H8 in California?

    And yet I will still applaud the Catholic church when Pope Francis speaks out on inequality and social injustice in the world. I can look at the whole picture and see there is some good to be celebrated and problems that have to be dealt with.

    You should consider the same about Islam, or does the fact they make caring for the poor one of their fundamental pillars of faith not appeal to you? You focus on the tribalism aspects of Islam that existed in those areas before Islam came and condemn the whole faith. And yes, those practices are horrible, but they are not the sum total of Islam and you should know better.

    GOP 2014 strategy -- Hire clowns, elephants, and a ringmaster and say "a media circus" has emerged and blame Democrats for lack of progress. Have pundits agree that "both sides are to blame" and hope the public will stay home on election day.

    by ontheleftcoast on Wed Jun 04, 2014 at 11:34:34 AM PDT

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    •  Until both libera/moderate catholics (1+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      Mxwll

      and muslims walk out the doors of their religious institutions and disavow their founding texts, they are tied at the hip to the fundamentalists in both camps and thus to their actions and the actions of their institutions.  I do not let them off the hook for any of it.  

      I will not applaud anything Pope Francis says on social justice or any other topic.  He has no moral basis to even discuss inequality and social justice as long as women are held in second class status in the world because of his church's policies.

      •  And I don't think throwing the baby out with (0+ / 0-)

        the bath water is the best way forward. Look at our own damn party and the problems it has. Do you seriously recommend every progressive pick up and leave the party because the Democrats aren't good enough? If so you need to re-think why your here at DK. And for religions you're asking people to abandon all the cultural ties, family ties, etc. that have bound them together for centuries just to make a point? Sorry, but you fail to understand the complexity of the issues. Nice sound bite you have, but a lousy plan of action.

        GOP 2014 strategy -- Hire clowns, elephants, and a ringmaster and say "a media circus" has emerged and blame Democrats for lack of progress. Have pundits agree that "both sides are to blame" and hope the public will stay home on election day.

        by ontheleftcoast on Wed Jun 04, 2014 at 02:11:09 PM PDT

        [ Parent ]

        •  Dirty bath water isn't good for baby (1+ / 0-)
          Recommended by:
          Fishtroller01

          ...and neither is the insidious tradition of religious superstition that has diseased civilizations for thousands of years.

          How pathetic it is to gag up a throw-away phrase as if it contributes anything meaningful.

          If you want your baby to survive in good health, throw the damned dirty bath water out and quit telling everybody how rotten it is for them to imagine a world that isn't chronically infested by a tradition of superstition.

          You tie cultural and family values inextricably to religion. I have Good News (TM) for you! Religious superstition doesn't own those human virtues. Religion has no monopoly on human virtue and goodness. Religion is NOT the necessary life-kit you think it is. Get the picture?

          •  And you completely misread my comment (0+ / 0-)

            I didn't say cultural and family are only available thru religion but you'd have to be a pretty colossal liar to say they weren't heavily influenced by it.

            Sure, crap all over religion if you want. Hell, there's ample evidence for doing so.

            And when you're part of a tiny, bitter minority wondering why nobody wants to work with you to solve big problems maybe you can reconsider your approach.

            GOP 2014 strategy -- Hire clowns, elephants, and a ringmaster and say "a media circus" has emerged and blame Democrats for lack of progress. Have pundits agree that "both sides are to blame" and hope the public will stay home on election day.

            by ontheleftcoast on Wed Jun 04, 2014 at 10:36:36 PM PDT

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            •  The lie is certainly "colossal"! (0+ / 0-)

              I did not 'misread' your comment. I responded to it because I understood it.

              How dare you insinuate that my comment in any way suggested that religion doesn't heavily influence culture.

              What the hell is the matter with you?

              Are you accustomed to being a liar?

              Your response? I hear you loud and clear. And I read sincere bullshit.

              I clearly read you crapping on people who have the temerity of exercising an opinion contrary to yours, and you get all agitated and have a cow.

              You seem peculiarly split. You knock at me for crapping on religion, yet you allow that there is ample evidence for doing so. WTF? Are you nuts too?

              Let me tell you something. When YOU inevitably become part of that tiresome and thankfully dwindling tiny minority of apologists devoted to propping up the incredible superstitious nonsense façade that is religion that has not ever in the slightest advanced the cause of human progress and enlightenment, and has not after thousands of years yielded the slightest clue to people just like you to quit acting like assholes toward each other, I will happily stand strong amongst the growing number of like-minded people who are sick and tired of people JUST LIKE YOU who think they have a premium AUTHORITY over what people ought to think.

              And I'll tell you right in your face here and now, your response is an obnoxious bastardization of what constitutes decent human behavior, pal, and you are perfectly free to mischaracterize my response as the 'bitter' outcome of a very very small and ultimately inconsequential mind.

              •  Nice to see you can quote Dawkins (0+ / 0-)

                Did you just finish reading The God Delusion last week?

                People like you used to make me embarrassed to be an atheist. But then I remember you're just an embarrassment with or without atheism in the mix. Have fun being bitter and resentful, it's obviously what you're good at.

                GOP 2014 strategy -- Hire clowns, elephants, and a ringmaster and say "a media circus" has emerged and blame Democrats for lack of progress. Have pundits agree that "both sides are to blame" and hope the public will stay home on election day.

                by ontheleftcoast on Thu Jun 05, 2014 at 08:41:29 AM PDT

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        •  It seems to me having observed the recent (0+ / 0-)

          sea change in attitudes about gays and gay marriage that it is a perfectly reasonable hope that religious people walk out the door.  Having been a Christian who walked out the door and into atheism, I can tell you that most family ties stay just as tight.   Yes, issues in religion ARE complex, but walking out the door is pretty simple actually and millions do it every day.

          I never said a word about progressive Dems and their relationship to the party, but I certainly am one who still feels that its OK to give the party a hard time when it deserves it.

    •  How 'bout excommunicating the mother and (2+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      ontheleftcoast, jessbell911

      the doctors who gave a nine-year-old -- a nine-year-old -- an abortion, after she'd been raped by her stepfather and was pregnant with twins, but not the stepfather?  When labor could have killed her?  And she was nine years old?

      And only didn't excommunicate the nine-year-old because she was nine years old?

      Ok, fine, I don't think excommunication does diddly, since it's not my religion.  But for believers, excommunication means they are forever cast out, they cannot be redeemed, they will go to hell and suffer forever.

      It was also Vatican policy to tell child victims of priest rape that if they told anyone they'd be excommunicated.  They were threatening children with eternal damnation for telling anyone -- a parent, a cop, a therapist, a sibling.  And this wasn't centuries ago.  This was in the late 20th century.

      © cai Visit 350.org to join the fight against global warming.

      by cai on Wed Jun 04, 2014 at 09:52:57 PM PDT

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