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View Diary: I don't give a flying f*@k about your "right" to keep and bear arms. (333 comments)

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  •  Can you ban guns entirely? (23+ / 0-)

    No.

    Can you regulate them and those who sell and use them?
    Damn right. And we need to, and ENFORCE those regulations.

    •  I don't accept this (14+ / 0-)

      Guns can be banned entirely despite the Militia Clause.
      When the last state militia disbanded, it rendered the Militia Clause defunct. There is no right to a gun. The Heller decision was wrongly decided just as the Dred Scott decision was and it will eventually be reversed or the Militia Clause repealed.  
      How many more innocent people must be needlessly slaughtered between now and then is the only question. This isn't going to stop until people can no longer get a hold of guns.

      +++ The law is a weapon used to bludgeon us peasants into submission. It is not to be applied to the monied elite.

      by cybersaur on Tue Jun 10, 2014 at 11:59:26 AM PDT

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      •  The framers foresaw that error (2+ / 0-)
        Recommended by:
        rb608, JayFromPA

        that's why the right belongs to "the people" and not to "members of the militia."

        Also, we still need a constitutional amendment abolishing standing armies.

        222 house republicans support the Ryan budget that would convert Medicare to a premium-support program. In other words, they want to repeal Medicare and replace it with a system that works just like Obamacare.

        by happymisanthropy on Tue Jun 10, 2014 at 12:50:27 PM PDT

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      •  But the state militias aren't disbanded. (2+ / 0-)
        Recommended by:
        drmah, kfunk937

        Every state has an organized state militia operating at the "(State) Army National Guard" and another state militia operating as the "(State) Air National Guard". Some states also have an organized state militia operating under the name of "(State) Naval Militia". Ohio is one such state. If I recall correctly, other states with an organized militia with that style of name is New York and New Jersey and I think Maryland - but I'm not positive off the top of my head.

        These are state militias, with the governor as Commander In Chief. If they are 'nationalized' that Commander In Chief becomes the potus.

        Sorry to piss on your parade, but you based a number of conclusions on false information.

        MLK Jr 1968 "Maybe we just have to admit that the day of violence is here, and maybe we have to just give up and let violence take its course. The nation won't listen to our voice - maybe it'll heed the voice of violence."

        by JayFromPA on Tue Jun 10, 2014 at 02:11:24 PM PDT

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      •  The militia was not armed by private guns for (0+ / 0-)

        very long -- and that was in the 17th century.

        This statute was enacted before there was a Constitution, and a Second Amendment:

        At a General Assembly begun and held at the Public Buildings in the City of Richmond, on Monday the 21st day of October, in the Year of our Lord 1782.

        Chap. XII.  

        An act for the recovery of arms and accoutrements belonging to the state.

        I.  Whereas sundry arms and accoutrements belonging to the public in the hands of individuals, who have neglected to return them to the proper officers; and it is necessary that such arms and accoutrements should be recovered as speedily as possible: Be it enacted, that the Governor do, on the passing of this act, issue his proclamation, enjoining all persons having in their possession any arms or accoutrements whatsoever, belonging to the state, to deliver them without delay to the Lieutenant or commanding officer of the county for the time being; and the sheriff of each county within this commonwealth, shall cause copies of the said proclamations, which shall be transmitted to him by the Executive, to be fixed up in the most public places in his county, and if after one month from such public notice having been given, any person possessing any such public arms or accoutrements, shall be convicted of having failed to deliver them up as aforesaid, such person shall, upon every such conviction, be liable to the penalty of twenty pounds, to be recovered by action of debt, bill, plaint, or information, in any court of record within this commonwealth, one half of which penalty shall go to the informer, on conviction of the offender, and the other half shall be applied in aid of the county levy where such offender shall reside.  And the Lieutenant, or commanding officer of each county, shall make returns from time to time, to the Executive, of all arms and accoutrements so delivered to him, and also deliver them to the order of the Executive, under the penalty, if he fail in all or any part of his duty, of fifty pounds, to be recovered as aforesaid, and applied in diminution of the county levy.  Provided always, that where muskets and bayonets have been by order of government placed in any county on eastern or western frontier for defence against incursions of the enemy, it shall be lawful for the Lieutenant or commanding officer to return such muskets and bayonets to the militia, taking a receipt from each person for what shall be so returned.

         

        A Collection of All Such Public Acts of the General Assembly, and Ordinances of the Conventions of Virginia, Passed since the year 1768, as are now in force; With a Table of the Principal Matters (Richmond: Thomas Nicolson and William Prentis, 1785); The First Laws of the State of Virginia (Wilmington, DE: Michael Glazier, Inc., "The First Laws of the Original Thirteen States," 1982), Compiled by John D. Cushing, at 176.

        And this Militia Act was enacted by Congress AFTER ratification of the Bill of Rights/Second Amendment:

        Chap. LXV.--An Act providing Arms for the Militia throughout the United States.

          Section 1.  Be it enacted by the Senate and House of Representatives of the United States of America in Congress assembled, That there shall be provided, at the charge and expense of the government of the United States, thirty thousand stand of arms, which shall be deposited by order of the President of the United States, at suitable places, for the purpose of being sold to the governments of the respective States, or the militia thereof, under such regulations, and at such prices as the President of the United States shall prescribe.
          Sec. 2.  And be it further enacted, That the President of the United States be, and he is hereby authorized to cause all or any part of the arms herein directed to be provided and deposited for sale, which shall, at any time, remain unsold, to be delivered to the militia, when called into the service of the United States, proper receipts and security being given for the return of the same.
          Sec. 3.  And be it further enacted, That the monies arising from such sales shall be paid into the treasury of the United States, and the amount received shall be annually reported to Congress.
          Sec. 4.  And be it further enacted, That for the purpose of carrying this act into effect, the President of the United States shall be, and he is hereby authorized to draw from the treasury of the United States, a [577] sum not exceeding four hundred thousand dollars, to be paid out of any money in the treasury not otherwise appropriated.
          Approved, July 6, 1798.

        The Public Statutes at Large of the United States of America, from the Organization of the Government in 1789, to March 3, 1845., Vol I." (Boston: Charles C. Little and James Brown, 1850), By Authority of Congress, Edited by Richard Peters, at 576.

        Reliance on privately-owned guns to arm the militia obviously ceased before there was a Constitution and Bill of Rights.  And the Constitution as ratified expressly stipulates --

        Art. I., S. 8., C. 16.  The Congress shall have Power To provide for . . . ARMING . . . the Militia.
        The Congress -- not the private individual gun-nut.

        This is the country of those three great rights: freedom of conscience, freedom of speech, and the wisdom never to exercise either of them. -- Mark Twain.

        by JJustin on Wed Jun 11, 2014 at 06:51:30 AM PDT

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