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View Diary: Nation's largest teachers union calls for Arne Duncan's resignation (203 comments)

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  •  Let me put it more pointedly: (60+ / 0-)

    Which is worse:

    a. that Obama supports Duncan's policies; or
    b. that Obama is so uninterested in educational policy that after 5 1/2 years he still doesn't know what Duncan is doing?

    Are you sure you want to go with the latter explanation?

    (Note: the one doesn't entirely preclude the other, of course.)

    Dogs from the street can have all the desirable qualities that one could want from pet dogs. Most adopted stray dogs are usually humble and exceptionally faithful to their owners as if they are grateful for this kindness. -- H.M. Bhumibol Adulyadej

    by corvo on Mon Jul 07, 2014 at 01:15:37 PM PDT

    [ Parent ]

    •  I'm not arguing with you. I'm just pointing out (3+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      cville townie, chimene, Larsstephens

      what I've seen.

      •  I've seen Duncan, Rahmbo, Geithner, Summers (19+ / 0-)

        Lew and plenty of others.  After awhile, one must stop looking at the appointees and look at the person who appointed them.

        Some men see things as they are and ask why. I dream of things that never were and ask why not?

        by RFK Lives on Tue Jul 08, 2014 at 06:10:36 AM PDT

        [ Parent ]

        •  Exactly. (8+ / 0-)

          President Obama put his people in where he wanted them, because they were precisely in line in what he believes--privatization of education services, so the Investor Class can have another commodity to feed their seemingly insatiable gambling addiction.

          Rahm Emanuel's having a ball instituting this same thing in Chicago, with predictably horrifying results for the 99%. He's turned that city into a neoliberal meth lab.

          Fighting against centrist, authoritarian, and conservative policies since 2002.

          by cybrestrike on Tue Jul 08, 2014 at 06:31:59 AM PDT

          [ Parent ]

          •  An executive is defined by his/her appointments (8+ / 0-)

            Either this Chief Executive never bothered vetting his key appointments, or he knew what he was getting when he appointed them.  While I might buy the argument that his immediate predecessor was ignorant about many of his key appointees, trying to apply that argument to this president is absurd on its face.

            Some men see things as they are and ask why. I dream of things that never were and ask why not?

            by RFK Lives on Tue Jul 08, 2014 at 07:01:01 AM PDT

            [ Parent ]

            •  I suspect it's mostly... (1+ / 0-)
              Recommended by:

              ...evidence of a lack of experience in a "buck stops here" job before being elected President.

              Experienced politicians and business executives get where they are, largely, on two factors. First, their vision. Second, their judgement of people so they can pick people to implement their vision that can actually do it. In this case, it's not clear which is lacking or if both are lacking.

              However, this was evident from the moment Obama set foot on stage. Hillary, by osmosis and intelligence and being First Lady for multiple terms of governor and two terms in the White House and having had real jobs was much more likely to be an effective administrator -- Obama was a idealistic choice w/o a real track record.

              Certainly, Obama was less controversial - but that's because, without a track record, he was a vessel into which each voter could pour their assumptions and those assumptions always seemed to fit. This as, of course, impossible to be reality, but far too many people ignored it.

              I'm not saying Hillary would have done differently, but I'm pretty sure supporters would have been less surprised by what she did.

        •  I consider the possibility that the (0+ / 0-)

          appointments were part of the ruling consensus, not solely the purview of the executive.

          I'm for truth, no matter who tells it. I'm for justice, no matter who it's for or against. ~ Malcolm X -8.62 -8.36

          by 4Freedom on Tue Jul 08, 2014 at 06:53:26 PM PDT

          [ Parent ]

        •  So why don't you demand Obama himself resign? (1+ / 0-)
          Recommended by:

          Teachers union demands Duncan resign, then the extreme left goes through a whole litany of people in the adminstration they demand resign, then the extreme left demands "look at the person who appointed them".  Well, merely "looking at Obama" isn't going to accomplish anything, indeed, it doesn't even call for accomplishing anything.

          At least the Tea Party states right up front that they want Obama impeached.  But the Obama bashers on the left don't have the courage to demand Obama's resignation or impeachment, which is the only way they'll get him out of office.  Instead they demand "looking at" him. lol

          Which means that all they're going to do in "looking at him" is to bash him on websites like someone shaking his fists at and shouting at the clouds.  You want something done?  Then call for it.

          •  What on earth... (1+ / 0-)
            Recommended by:
            Punditus Maximus

            ...has Obama done that would even begin to raise to the level of calling for his impeachment or resignation? There's a long history of executive officers and staffers falling on their swords, rarely does the CIC do so.

            Bad judgement in a single appointment (or even several) or revealing that one's actual views when hit with political reality don't match exactly what the voters expected are hardly a justification for either impeachment (a very high bar) or resignation (in absence of a pending impeachment likely to be successful or a dreadful crisis caused by mismanagement, extremely unlikely).

            •  The fact is that there's no reason for any of the (0+ / 0-)

              long list of Obama appointees hated by the "true left" to resign.  They have no scandals, they have no signs of malfeasance, instead, they merely differ on policy with the extreme left.  Well, sorry, that is not a reason to resign.  (And that's one reason the demand by teachers union for Duncan to resign is a pathetic joke.)

              If one is going to demand folks' resignation for mere disagreement on policy, then why not demand the President's resignation for that reason as well?  After all, as the comment I replied says, he appointed them.

              The comment to which I was responding, which purports to speak for the "true left", says "it's time to look at the guy that appointed them [these guys we hate over policy disagreements]".  OK, after "looking at" Obama, then what?  You've accomplished nothing by doing that.

              The Obama bashes on the left dream of getting Obama out of office, but unlike their tea-party counterpart Obama haters, they don't have the guts to call for it.  They instead demand, "looking at" Obama, which essentially means, "bashing him over and over, and condemning him, and trying to convince everyone else to loathe him as much as we do".  To what end?  To zero end, that's what.

    •  more to the point (49+ / 0-)

      Duncan and Obama are supporting Bill Gates.  They don't want to educate and enrich children, they want to produce little worker clones for jobs that are going overseas.   I wish they would keep their grubby mitts off my vagina and my kids.

      The education reform movement must be defined in terms of its ideology, its strategies and its leading members.

      The “reformers” say they want excellent education for all; they want great teachers; they want to “close the achievement gap”; they want innovation and effectiveness; they want the best of everything for everyone. They pursue these universally admired goals by privatizing education, lowering the qualifications for future teachers, replacing teachers with technology, increasing class sizes, endorsing for- profit organizations to manage schools, using carrots and sticks to motivate teachers and elevating standardized test scores as the ultimate measure of education quality.

      “Reform” is really a misnomer, because the advocates for this cause seek not to reform public education but to transform it into an entrepreneurial sector of the economy. The groups and individuals that constitute today’s reform movement have appropriated the word “reform” because it has such positive connotations in American political discourse and American history. But the roots of this so- called reform movement may be traced to a radical ideology with a fundamental distrust of public education and hostility to the public sector in general.  link

      I will not vote for Hillary.

      by dkmich on Mon Jul 07, 2014 at 04:02:20 PM PDT

      [ Parent ]

      •  Reform always reminds of the Ree-form candidate (5+ / 0-)

        in O Brother, Where Art Thou? who turned out to be the Klan leader who tried to lynch one of the Soggy Bottom Boys.

        Admittedly, he had the best song in the entire movie, Oh, Death (Won't you spare me over til another year?)

        Dubbed in the movie by Ralph Stanley.

        Back off, man. I'm a logician.—GOPBusters™

        by Mokurai on Mon Jul 07, 2014 at 11:26:16 PM PDT

        [ Parent ]

      •  Duncan's Folly (3+ / 0-)
        Recommended by:
        jbsoul, IreGyre, hawkseye

        Yes, to all the above  -  and instead of insisting that "all students have access to highly effective teachers," it would help if Mr Duncan would help teachers (especially in low-performing schools) to have some "highly effective" students, parents, and supporting culture.

        •  "Highly effective teachers" defined by us... (2+ / 0-)
          Recommended by:
          hawkseye, musiclady

          easy to fire or swap around if they do not comply... if they are compliant in ways we define... then they are "highly effective" in passing along the corporate PR approved packets of education commodities our patrons are roping everyone into buying... and in general producing the kinds of finished product graduates to either fit into our temp employment model landscape or take on huge student loan burdens with the illusion of choice or expectation of employment later

          Pogo & Murphy's Law, every time. Also "Trust but verify" - St. Ronnie (hah...)

          by IreGyre on Wed Jul 09, 2014 at 07:00:30 AM PDT

          [ Parent ]

      •  Perfectly Said. Education Deform is the word they (0+ / 0-)

        were searching for.

        Figures don't lie, but liars do figure-Mark Twain

        by OregonOak on Tue Jul 08, 2014 at 10:01:08 PM PDT

        [ Parent ]

    •  You've said "I really, really loathe Obama", so (0+ / 0-)

      the answer to the question you pose from your perspective is all to obvious, as you let your loathing of the man dictate your views on everything about him.

      But that sad thing for you is that for all your moaning and bashing of the man, you can't do a damn thing about it. He's already won reelection.  So you just have to live with it, all your bashing and loathing will accomplish absolutely zero to get him out of office.  You're in the same pickle as the Tea Partiers that loath him in equal measure as you do.

      Or are you going to sink so low as to support Boenher's suit against the President, is your loathing so great that you'd go even that low? lol

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