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View Diary: Gaza Is Transforming American Jews: Words from an Overflowing Inbox (439 comments)

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  •  American Jews are just learning (24+ / 0-)

    what every diaspora ethnicity learns over time:

    One's ethnic lineage only links one's opinion in lockstep to that of the citizens still in one's homeland only for so long. This is even true of the Jews, one of the few human populations who consider their religious ancestry primary to their ethnic or national identities.

    Frankly, I've always thought that unsustainable and by definition exclusionary.

    Everything good a man can be, a dog already is. - pajoly

    by pajoly on Mon Aug 04, 2014 at 09:59:58 AM PDT

    •  Although I think it is more complicated (17+ / 0-)

      because of the intersection of ethnicity and religion, but your overall point makes a lot of sense.

      Join us on the Black Kos front porch to review news and views written from a black pov—everyone is welcome.

      by TomP on Mon Aug 04, 2014 at 10:03:31 AM PDT

      [ Parent ]

    •  Pajoly, I don't think your model of homeland vs... (4+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      ivote2004, pixxer, 417els, bink

      Pajoly, I don't think your model of homeland vs diaspora quite fits here, because most Jews in the diaspora don't descend from Jews in Israel. The Jewish diaspora culture existed first and overall is built on the concept of "do unto others as you would want them to do unto you". The Israelis have morphed into "F*ck them before they can f*ck us". For me, as a progressive supporter of Israel (DGH style!) I find that terribly dismaying. So I agree with you that there is real dissonance between many - at least the liberal - diaspora Jews and Israelis, but I think that the Israelis are the ones changing. It's like they drank the Bush-Cheney kool-aid and became permanently warped... However, the thing that I think is hard for non-Jews to grasp is that we progressive Jews still strongly support the existence of Israel as a Jewish state, even if we hate their government and their wicked treatment of Palestinians. We want them to change and to seek peace, not disappear. I think this is because Israel was created by the Jewish diaspora; it is an expression of our self-determination. But I and many other progressive Jews are not blind and we see the apartheid and the movement towards ethnic cleansing and are really disturbed by this. We are glad we have found a voice in DGH who speaks our point of view!

      •  re previous post, whoops; DGH not DHG... (0+ / 0-)

        re previous post, whoops; DGH not DHG...

      •  Israelis are far from monolithic. (0+ / 0-)

        DocG, I'll agree with much of what you've said, and go somewhat further.

        Israelis are far from monolithic.

        Modern Israel is far from a homeland from which a diaspora spread, as was posited upthread:

        what every diaspora ethnicity learns over time:

        One's ethnic lineage only links one's opinion in lockstep to that of the citizens still in one's homeland only for so long.

        Modern Israel is as much a fresh synthesis of incoming diaspora -- some refugee (from many diverse lands) and some visionary (towards many diverse ideals) -- as it is any continuation of homeland, tribe, or tradition.

        So the old saying "where you have 2 jews, you have 3 different points of view" is more true than ever.

        The schizoidifying crazyness of recent time shifts that ratio even further.... to now "where you have 1 Jew, you have 3 different points of view".... and even "where you have 1 thinking feeling conscious Israeli, no one can keep track of how many different points of view they feel compelled to see things from" :(

        Israel has been more like a pumping heart..... with diaspora coming in and going out.... and, alas, never being able to rest, for long, at any home.

        ~

        #3: ensure network neutrality; #2: ensure electoral integrity; #1: ensure ecosystemic sustainability.

        by ivote2004 on Mon Aug 04, 2014 at 09:50:16 PM PDT

        [ Parent ]

      •  Well, I supported the continued existence of (1+ / 0-)
        Recommended by:
        417els

        the US, even when GWB was in charge. Perhaps that is not as difficult a concept as it might seem...

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