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View Diary: "Humanitarian Emergency" Does Not Suspend the Constitution on War Powers (62 comments)

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  •  I Don't Think He Ordered Offensive Military Strks. (2+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    TJ, sturunner

    There was repeated emphasize on the verb "authorize" as opposed to "order" in the news yesterday. Plus if as I believe is advertised, it's to protect humanitarian relief efforts, as opposed to delivering support for a fighting faction, that would seem to me to be arguably within his power.

    I'll look back for the discussion in a while.

    We are called to speak for the weak, for the voiceless, for victims of our nation and for those it calls enemy.... --ML King "Beyond Vietnam"

    by Gooserock on Fri Aug 08, 2014 at 09:11:46 AM PDT

    •  He bombed something (6+ / 0-)

      Who gives a shit about the reason or the tortured justifications.

      This situation is exactly why Congress has the exclusive power to declare war. Murky foreign situation, entanglements, etc.

      If the President can't or won't get Congressional authorization then he can't do it. Period. Too bad, so sad.

      (-5.50,-6.67): Left Libertarian
      Leadership doesn't mean taking a straw poll and then just throwing up your hands. -Jyrinx

      by Sparhawk on Fri Aug 08, 2014 at 09:18:51 AM PDT

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      •  He had an artillery unit and a truck towing it (5+ / 0-)
        Recommended by:
        merrywidow, sturunner, bear83, oblomov, gratis4

        bombed and I believe a given reason is that ISIS is advancing towards an area with American servicemen.  ISIS has given no indication that they'd give Americans any special free pass and only go after Iraqi's and artillery isn't that precise anyway.  

        In the early reports, it sounds like a defensive action (preventing them from setting up and shooting at Americans).  What really has happened will be determined and it may all be exactly what the initial story is.

        •  Don't make me laugh (0+ / 0-)

          The President can't evacuate those service personnel?

          (-5.50,-6.67): Left Libertarian
          Leadership doesn't mean taking a straw poll and then just throwing up your hands. -Jyrinx

          by Sparhawk on Fri Aug 08, 2014 at 11:45:43 AM PDT

          [ Parent ]

          •  So whenever we can evacuate (almost 100% the time) (1+ / 0-)
            Recommended by:
            ColoTim

            we cannot defend ourselves?  We are there because the Iraqi government (such as it is) asked us or at least agreed to our being there.  We are doing what may well be useful work there.

            You'd empower a bunch of religious waqrriors to determine our foreign policy for us?  Oh-- wait . . .  .

            Their real God is money-- Jesus just drives the armored car, and his hat is made in China. © 2009 All Rights Reserved

            by oblomov on Fri Aug 08, 2014 at 01:08:07 PM PDT

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            •  The Constitution empowers Congress (1+ / 0-)
              Recommended by:
              gratis4

              If they vote to order the President to get militarily involved in a foreign civil war, then he can get involved in a foreign civil war.

              If they don't, he has to protect our people using non-military means or "immediate self-defense" needs if that is not possible (but again, don't make me laugh about his capability to evacuate).

              The President has no power to make war without explicit permission from Congress. It's that simple. If he wanted to make law he should have stayed in Congress.

              (-5.50,-6.67): Left Libertarian
              Leadership doesn't mean taking a straw poll and then just throwing up your hands. -Jyrinx

              by Sparhawk on Fri Aug 08, 2014 at 01:43:58 PM PDT

              [ Parent ]

      •  He's still commander in chief. (1+ / 0-)
        Recommended by:
        bear83

        If Congress doesn't like his strikes, they can defund them.

        ISIS isn't a country in any case, a formal declaration of war would be strange.

        •  Commander in chief is meaningless (0+ / 0-)

          He is a tool to implement the will of Congress, nothing more. He can't blow his nose without permission.

          Congress says "go to war here", he does.
          Congress tells him to stop, he does.

          It's that simple.

          (-5.50,-6.67): Left Libertarian
          Leadership doesn't mean taking a straw poll and then just throwing up your hands. -Jyrinx

          by Sparhawk on Fri Aug 08, 2014 at 12:45:47 PM PDT

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          •  Ignorance may be a reason, but is no excuse, for (0+ / 0-)

            silly absolutist utterances.

            Their real God is money-- Jesus just drives the armored car, and his hat is made in China. © 2009 All Rights Reserved

            by oblomov on Fri Aug 08, 2014 at 01:09:14 PM PDT

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            •  No matter who it is (0+ / 0-)

              The President and his/her lackeys would love you to believe something different, but per the Constitution this is the absolute truth.

              Congress holds all the strings all the time. The President makes executive and judicial appointments (who must be approved by Congress), and can veto bills (which if Congress overrides he must implement anyway).

              Other than that he just does whatever Congress tells him to. That's his job, nothing more, nothing less.

              (-5.50,-6.67): Left Libertarian
              Leadership doesn't mean taking a straw poll and then just throwing up your hands. -Jyrinx

              by Sparhawk on Fri Aug 08, 2014 at 01:29:31 PM PDT

              [ Parent ]

    •  Well I think they're all offensive by definition (3+ / 0-)

      ...in that ISIS isn't attacking the US.  Defense of a third party ought to count as "offense" when it comes to whatever constraints we have for that kind of thing.  I just don't know if we ever stopped being in Iraq for legal purposes, so I'm not sure we're "going back in" in a way that requires a new authorization.

      It's not the side effects of the cocaine/I'm thinking that it must be love

      by Rich in PA on Fri Aug 08, 2014 at 09:18:55 AM PDT

      [ Parent ]

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