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View Diary: Egypt urges 'restraint' in Ferguson (148 comments)

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  •  Please don't particularize the longstanding (0+ / 0-)

    problem of racism.

    Sidearms? Police? US Exceptionalism? Yeah, them too but they aren't the problem either.

    "...we live in the best most expensive third world country." "If only the NEA could figure out all they have to do is define the ignorance of the next generation as a WMD..." ---Stolen from posts on Daily Kos

    by jestbill on Tue Aug 19, 2014 at 11:25:40 AM PDT

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    •  So I should only speak in vague generalities? (1+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      ram27

      Why am I not supposed to cite individual cases as demonstrating the larger problem?

      Art is the handmaid of human good.

      by joe from Lowell on Tue Aug 19, 2014 at 11:29:36 AM PDT

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      •  But 'militarism' is not an 'individual case?' (0+ / 0-)

        "...we live in the best most expensive third world country." "If only the NEA could figure out all they have to do is define the ignorance of the next generation as a WMD..." ---Stolen from posts on Daily Kos

        by jestbill on Tue Aug 19, 2014 at 12:56:35 PM PDT

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        •  "The militarization of police." Not "militarism." (1+ / 0-)
          Recommended by:
          ram27

          The former is about the adoption of military and para-military equipment and tactics by law enforcement in their dealings with the public. The latter is a mindset that largely applies to foreign affairs.

          And neither are an individual case, but rather, broad categories.

          They're also not subsets of racism, but distinct issues that can overlap with racism.

          Art is the handmaid of human good.

          by joe from Lowell on Tue Aug 19, 2014 at 01:00:00 PM PDT

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          •  How long do you intend (0+ / 0-)

            to defend the indefensible?  To misinterpret the obvious?

            The militarism of the police is a symptom of the racism.  If every citizen were a good clean white person, (Trademark that snark) then there never would have been such an escalation of weaponry.  Racism.

            You seem to be reacting as if we were getting side tracked into a gun control argument.  Gee!  Ya think?

            Why do RWNJs buy guns?  For 'protection.'  From what?  It's racism all the way down.

            Your individual case is just one of many--claiming that police militarization is somehow different is a difference that does not make any difference.

            "...we live in the best most expensive third world country." "If only the NEA could figure out all they have to do is define the ignorance of the next generation as a WMD..." ---Stolen from posts on Daily Kos

            by jestbill on Tue Aug 19, 2014 at 01:17:29 PM PDT

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            •  No, it's not a symptom of racism. Remember OWS? (0+ / 0-)

              There are two distinct issues interacting here, and no, I'm not going to be bullied into picking one over the other.

              Police militarization is a distinct issue from the long-standing problem of police violence against African-Americans. What we're seeing in Ferguson is the two combining and interacting.

              The "X is a Y issue" argument can be applied to anything. "Abortion is an economic issue." "Labor rights are an environmental issue." "Global warming is a labor issue." And behind each of these statements, you can find some truth; there are economic implications to abortion rights, there are environmental implications to labor, and there are labor implications to global warming.  The observation that anything in American history can be shown to have a racism angle, likewise. But the presence of such a taint does not subvert all other issues into subsets of racism.

              Your theory that policing wouldn't become militarized in all-white societies runs up against some pretty compelling historical evidence to the contrary.

              Art is the handmaid of human good.

              by joe from Lowell on Tue Aug 19, 2014 at 02:58:54 PM PDT

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            •  Also, throwing out "defend the indefensible" is... (0+ / 0-)

              just posturing for the cameras.

              You're taking a phrase that actually has a meaning, and using it like something close to punctuation. You're adding no extra meaning, just trying to punch up your language, like you're impersonating someone with a righteous point.

              I don't even know what it is you think I'm defending. There was nothing that was attacked.

              Art is the handmaid of human good.

              by joe from Lowell on Tue Aug 19, 2014 at 03:04:25 PM PDT

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              •  Nope. (0+ / 0-)

                The "defend the indefensible" phrase is in response to your continued deafness to the point that your example is just another example.  Your original complaint was that people were using the wrong example.  The rest of this discussion is mostly literature.

                There are no cameras here.  When it comes to "compelling historical examples" it's pretty clear that nobody much cares what I have to say.

                Your theory that policing wouldn't become militarized in all-white societies runs up against some pretty compelling historical evidence to the contrary.
                I suppose that's meant to imply that our society was bound to become a police state even if it were all-white? My supposed theory balances yours (also supposed) in being an extreme theory of history.

                Police used their toys against OWS because they had 'em.  They had them because people who voted, voted for "law and order" damn the consequences.

                "...we live in the best most expensive third world country." "If only the NEA could figure out all they have to do is define the ignorance of the next generation as a WMD..." ---Stolen from posts on Daily Kos

                by jestbill on Thu Aug 21, 2014 at 09:04:58 AM PDT

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                •  Like I said, utterly meaningless. (0+ / 0-)

                  Nothing but punctuation.

                  You might as well have typed a frowny emoticon.

                  I've gotten weary of people trying to impersonate smart people by misusing phrases they've heard smart people use.

                  Art is the handmaid of human good.

                  by joe from Lowell on Fri Aug 22, 2014 at 07:57:36 AM PDT

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                  •  LOL--pot, see kettle. (0+ / 0-)

                    I know you are but what am I?

                    Rubber/glue?

                    Ahhh, I grow weary.

                    Nice talking to you.  Bye.

                    "...we live in the best most expensive third world country." "If only the NEA could figure out all they have to do is define the ignorance of the next generation as a WMD..." ---Stolen from posts on Daily Kos

                    by jestbill on Sat Aug 23, 2014 at 08:54:21 AM PDT

                    [ Parent ]

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