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View Diary: A Question about Privilege (82 comments)

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  •  Louis CK on white privilege: (4+ / 0-)

    And on male privilege:

    Ancora Impara--Michelangelo

    by aravir on Thu Aug 28, 2014 at 09:56:16 AM PDT

    •  Heart disease is the leading cause of death... (0+ / 0-)

      in women as well. And some groups of white men have been oppressed throughout history Louis probably wouldn't have enjoyed being a white european while the Romans were invading. Many of my ancestors were Scots-Irish, and were oppressed on both sides of the Atlantic. Which is not to say there isn't truth in what he's saying.

      •  *facepalm* (4+ / 0-)

        Yeah. You're just straight up trolling now.

        Two hundred fifty years of slavery. Ninety years of Jim Crow. Sixty years of separate but equal. Thirty-five years of racist housing policy. Until we reckon with our compounding moral debts, America will never be whole. - Ta-Nehisi Coates

        by moviemeister76 on Thu Aug 28, 2014 at 10:15:35 AM PDT

        [ Parent ]

        •  I'm not one to proselytize but (3+ / 0-)
          Recommended by:
          nicteis, Catte Nappe, orestes1963

          If someone wants to open a dialogue, sometimes it takes a while to see the light.  This diary stated things much more clearly and honestly than I ever see from people who usually make that argument.  In fact, their refusal to think things through and ask questions is part of their smug indifference about women and minorities.  So I don't think this is trolling or that the diarist should be shut down by a group mentality.

          •  I was patient and did engage (7+ / 0-)

            And then the diarist started responding to everyone's comments in a dickish manner. Any time a white person wants to play oppression Olympics by talking about their oppressed white ancestors, I'm done thinking the dialogue is going to be constructive.

            Two hundred fifty years of slavery. Ninety years of Jim Crow. Sixty years of separate but equal. Thirty-five years of racist housing policy. Until we reckon with our compounding moral debts, America will never be whole. - Ta-Nehisi Coates

            by moviemeister76 on Thu Aug 28, 2014 at 10:37:02 AM PDT

            [ Parent ]

            •  I didn't read all the responses by the diarist (3+ / 0-)

              We usually don't look our best when we get defensive.  And then we say things like "This is the problem, anything white people say can be discounted simply because they're white."  

              Actually the problem (and I'm going by experience talking to family members and white friends) is feeling the need to be defensive about white people.  I don't care about other white people as white people.  I feel no need to defend them based on their whiteness.  And I've been wrong enough times by myself to have a hard time defending just me.  

              Getting defensive is kind of the first mistake.  If I'm being racist or wrong I want to know.  Maybe I shouldn't have recommended this diary for stating things in a non-dickish way.  But sometimes, days or weeks later, a switch can be flipped and a person can see the world in a completely different way, just because they opened the door a little to other ideas and views.

          •  Would you agree that there's a difference (2+ / 0-)

            between "group mentality" and several people coming to the same conclusion ? Each of us who has responded has done so as an individual (and I mean initial comments...not discussions that may result from them ).

            And I disagree that this is more clear and honest than many to most of the other diaries similar to this.  It's about the same.

            We view "The Handmaid's Tale" as cautionary. The GOP views it as an instruction book.

            by Vita Brevis on Thu Aug 28, 2014 at 11:07:09 AM PDT

            [ Parent ]

            •  Maybe I was wrong (2+ / 0-)
              Recommended by:
              Vita Brevis, Catte Nappe

              But I've experienced trying to swim upstream in the comments section of a DKos diary-- it ain't pretty!

              Anyway, now I'm worried that my own thinking is wrong because I thought this diary was worth recommending.  And I'm usually not one to hold back, or want others to hold back, when it comes to pointing out racism or sexism.  

              In a sense I was trying to empathize with the diarist-- I wonder if that's ever a mistake.

              I guess all I can say is-- the hurt feelings of white males might be due to adjusting to changes that are happening quickly after centuries of white male domination.  It's an awkward and sometimes painful phase.  But then I also wonder if there is something deep within people that can't be changed-- because every time I think things are improving, there are more signs of the same old racism and sexism.

              So just having hurt feelings is a more attractive alternative than a nightmarish scenario where certain groups in this country will always default to an oppressive mentality (and act on this, sometimes in deadly ways).

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