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View Diary: Pat Tillman, GOP hero, OPPOSED the War (234 comments)

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  •  No one would ever think that (3.80)
    Only a dumbass would think his squad-mates fragged him. He was killed by friendly-fire, which happens all the time. And, in my opinion, I don't think the cause of his death(friendly fire) should have ever been released to anyone. It's not important at all, and it doesn't make him any less of a hero, at least in my eyes. He is a hero to me because he turned down loads of money, to participate in something greater than himself, and that showed how un-selfish he was. Unlike all the other selfish, money-hungry men in professional sports today. And I'm sure he had his own good reasons for enlisting, as we all did. Just because men go to fight for their govt in a war, doesn't mean they are fighting FOR the govt. They(and me) all have their own, and very different, reasons. Bush gives himself way too much credit, because we didn't fight for him or his policies at all, we fought for ours. And that's it really, not so complicated after all.
    •  I disagree... (4.00)
      I believe his family had the right to know the circumstances of his death.

      "Therefore, I shall resign the Presidency effective at noon tomorrow. Vice President Cheney will resign as well." Bush - Speech Tomorrow

      by isbister on Sun Sep 25, 2005 at 05:51:41 PM PDT

      [ Parent ]

    •  People say all kinds of things (4.00)
      and can get believed.  Surely we learned this in the last election cycle.
    •  Oh lookee, lookee (none)
      somebody not only thought it, but said it.
    •  I understand you, of course, (none)
      but if a superior was in any way at fault, shouldn't that come out so that it won't happen in the future.  What the heck do i know about war?  Nothing really but why should officers be promoted if they are at fault.  Of if some of the fellow soldiers  are careless or nervous with the trigger -- maybe they shouldn't be in battle. -- No really thinking person thinks of him as less than a hero - no matter the friendly fire.  

      The beneficiaries are likely to be...large corporations and development firms. (O'Connor, J. dissenting in Kelo). God bless you, J. O'Connor.

      by xanthe on Sun Sep 25, 2005 at 08:42:22 PM PDT

      [ Parent ]

      •  My take (none)
        war always includes random bad luck and insufficient communication.

        His c/o should NOT be held liable, or held back. People die in war, all the time. Should his C/o have known it was possible? Yes. But he won't forget the incident anytime soon, probably for the rest of his life, seems reasoable not to harp on something unintentional.

        sh** happens. That's why the c/o is supposed to write the letter.

        That's why Rumsfelds sign-o-matic was so deeply deeply offensive.

        it's the lying afterwards that gets me.

         

        Creationists make it sound as though a 'theory' is something you dreamt up after being drunk all night - Carl Sagan (1934 - 1996)

        by mdhatter on Sun Sep 25, 2005 at 09:20:01 PM PDT

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        •  Not even the lying (none)
          If it were only that one might understand but the deliberate misuse of his death for ulterior politcal and militaristic purposes was just unconscienceable. As one writer put it, Tillman became far more valuable dead than alive, and these bastards siezed on their opportunity with relish. May they all end up in Hell.

          "Go fuck yourself, Mr. Cheney!! Go fuck yourself, asshole!!--Dr. Ben Marble greets Dick

          by Scarce on Sun Sep 25, 2005 at 09:30:08 PM PDT

          [ Parent ]

        •  I'm not saying . . . (none)
          that he was murdered.

          However, if any death in war can be chalked up to "shit happens," you've opened up the door for pretty easy disposal of problemmatic people.

          The trouble with many conspiracy theories is the difficulty and complexity of pulling them off.  If more than a couple people need to keep a secret and if any of them have more to gain by talking than by keeping quiet, your conspiracy is going to fall apart.

          But if just one or two people need to keep a secret, and they've got motivation for doing so . . .

          I just wonder if the whole thing has been investigated thoroughly enough by truly independent investigators, that's all.

    •  What about... (none)
      when the Pentagon allows for a heroic fantasy of the action, such as was originally the case in Tillmans death, or when they let it run even further in the case of Pvt. Jessica Lynch?

      I know where you're comming from and agree with it in concept, but there is far too much suppression of the ugly truth of war.

      I too think only a dumbass would believe Tillman was fragged. You have to feel bad for the soldier(s) who made that mistake.  No way something like that doesn't haunt you the rest of your life, they may be a second casualty in many ways.

      And even though Jessica Lynch never fired a shot at the enemy (her gun jammed) she was a soldier serving her country, suffered being taken prisoner, and deserves to be reguarded with honor.

      Tillman was a hero who died in combat.  Full stop.

      The most important thing about life is to stay amused by it.

      by Paulie200 on Sun Sep 25, 2005 at 09:51:05 PM PDT

      [ Parent ]

    •  Bush gives himself way too much credit (none)
      because we didn't fight for him or his policies at all, we fought for ours.

      Indeed he does.  Every time I see one of those "I support President Bush and our troops" bumper stickers, my blood pressure goes through the roof. I support our troops too, I fervently hope that they all come home safe and sound.

    •  I agree that he was a hero... (none)
      What's significant about his story, in addition to his heroism, is that the military invented a fairy story about his death, which served BushCo's propaganda purposes.  That had to come out.
    •  simple (none)
      Very simple why he enlisted, you speculate like it's a question.  He enlisted because we were attacked on 9/11 by terrorists who were harbored in Afghanistan.  Iraq never attacked us, and to take our priorities away from the real enemy, and to start a war that required all of our resources and man power, was not only absurb, it was completely against the reason we went to fight in Afghanistan, to stop al-qaeda...us going to Iraq completely and totally dropped the ball on national security, and fightin terrorism, and now that we are in Iraq, we have provided the perfect training ground for terrorists around the world...

      The reaons for invading Afghanistan and Iraq are completely unrelated...I don't know why anyone would be able to forget this...HE ENLISTED TO FIGHT OUR ENEMIES IN AFGHANISTAN, WE WERE NEVER ATTACKED BY IRAQ, SO LIKE ANYONE IN THEIR RIGHT MIND, HE OPPOSED DROPPING THE BALL ON OSAMA, AND WORRYING ABOUT POLICING ANOTHER COUNTRY THAT WAS NEVER A THREAT TO US.  

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