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View Diary: Bill Clinton tells Dems to Fight or "Find Something Else To Do" (428 comments)

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  •  Who cares what the anit-choice wingnuts think? (4.00)
    I can never understand why pro-choice Democrats are so reticent to talk about being pro-choice. If a majority of prospective voters are pro-choice or neutral on the subject,  it would seem that Democrats can't lose on a pro-choice platform except in the extremely conservative "pro-birth" districts (obviously).

    The wingnut faction - the GOP's religious right base is NOT going to vote  for a Democrat anyway and what is that  - maybe 20% of regular voters?

    It seems most people in the middle-of-the-road don't care strongly one way or the other about reproductive rights as a  primary voting issue, but wouldn't necessarily be turned off by a pro-choice platform. And then there are those, like me, who do vote pro-choice.

    •  The point is, we've let them win. (4.00)
      On this, just like many other issues. This is part of what Bill Clinton was saying. We should refuse to allow the terms "pro-life" and "pro-abortion" to be used. We should be in the faces of every anti-choice person asking them what they are doing to reduce the numbers of abortions (meaning reduce the need for abortions).

      Their entire anti-choice frame is a house of cards.

      1. Nobody that I have ever met or heard of is "pro-abortion". Show me one frigging person out there who is saying "Oh yeah, abortions are really great--we sure need to have more of them."

      2. How many anti-choice people have adopted children...other than Tom DeLay?

      3. A constitutional ban on abortion WILL NOT end abortion. All it will do is give the talibangelicals a "moral" victory and kill women.

      4. By most analyses, the ratio of number of abortions to population in this country has been pretty steady for decades.

      5. If we want to lower our abortion rate so it is closer to other industrialized nations we will have to do some of the things they are doing, including teaching our children to act responsibly with their sexuality and not force feed them ignorance, myth, and lies.

      6. Support people who are doing effective things to reduce the need for abortion, providing they are not seeking to control or dehumanize women.

      7. Take back the moral high ground from these goddam liars and thugs. Especially the men.

      8. Finally, Safe. Legal. Rare.

      There's a start.

      "Nobody's coming to get her." (the NOLA emergency worker's mother who drowned in the nursing home after five days waiting)

      by homogenius on Sun Oct 30, 2005 at 08:31:05 AM PST

      [ Parent ]

      •  indeed: "Safe. Legal. Rare." (none)
        Excellent post, all the way `round. And I looooove "talibangelicals." I've never heard that one. Excellent!!

        ...Freedom is on the march. Straight to the gas chamber. this is infidelica...

        by snookybeh on Sun Oct 30, 2005 at 08:49:14 AM PST

        [ Parent ]

        •  Unfortunately, not mine. (none)
          I got talibangelicals from some other "genius". LOL

          But I will take credit for American Fascist Association and Confederate Women for America.

          "Nobody's coming to get her." (the NOLA emergency worker's mother who drowned in the nursing home after five days waiting)

          by homogenius on Sun Oct 30, 2005 at 09:29:10 AM PST

          [ Parent ]

      •  exactly! n/t (none)

        No one can make you feel inferior without your consent - Eleanor Roosevelt

        by PAbluestater on Sun Oct 30, 2005 at 08:52:18 AM PST

        [ Parent ]

      •  Safe Legal and Rare (none)
        I remember Kerry during the debates, he bumbled his way through "the courts have spoken", and he "can't impose his views on others". Pathetic.

        I think Bush responded with Dred Scott. We were bewildered. Skewered the court, while stroking blacks.  That wire in his back.

        This is where Hillary can help. I heard she had made some moderating statements.  Abortion has been a millstone around our necks.

        By 2008 the Supremes will have taken abortion off the table. States will decide.  I hope we don't emolate ourselves over this for another 2 decades.

      •  Well said. (none)
        The point is, we've let them win.

        Oh believe me, I do understand the point. I get so frustrated by the hemming and hawing of Democrats who seem to have swallowed the GOP spin that speaking reasonably about abortion, reproductive rights and contraceptive education is somehow equal to being in favor of killing "babies"  (at least to the real fetus-fetishists).

        Most Americans don't buy the wingnut perspective.  I think taking an assertive and practical position is exactly what's needed. Too bad it's taken so long to arrive at this point. Democrats should have challenging the wingnut perspective all along rather than acting like the issue is radioactive.

         "Safe. Legal. Rare." is a winning strategy, and more national Democrats should repeat it often when the subject arises.  

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