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View Diary: Real Democratic Solutions: Public Pre-Kindergarten (39 comments)

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  •  Go to a (none)
    Montessori classroom and you'll see freedom.

    Remember the alternative is largely unregulated in-home care and uneducated stay-at-home moms.

    Everybody talks about John Edwards' energy, intellect and charisma -- Bill Clinton

    by philgoblue on Mon Nov 07, 2005 at 11:51:13 AM PST

    [ Parent ]

    •  please don't stereotype (none)
      First of all, studies of homeschoolers suggest that they score in the low 80 percentiles on standardized tests regardless of parents' level of education.  People who do not homeschool find this hard to believe.  People who DO homeschool, and have to tear the math workbook away from their kid at 8pm because it is bedtime (this happened to us last week, my daughter is 5) do not find it hard to believe at all.  Want a kid to learn?  Give them some materials and stand back.  Enough options are available at the high school level to make up for what parents do not know.  And heck, what does my M.S. have to do with high school biology anyway?  I don't remember a thing!

      Secondly, studies further suggest that the level of state regulation is uncorrelated with homeschooled students' performance.  Oh, and another thing that is largely uncorrelated?  Race.  That stubborn "achievement gap" is a heck of a lot smaller among homeschooled students.  Statistics/studies backing up my points can be found on one page, here.

      I have never let my schooling interfere with my education. -- Mark Twain

      by vinifera on Mon Nov 07, 2005 at 12:13:19 PM PST

      [ Parent ]

      •  Ug (none)
        Spare  me your homeschooling cult propaganda.,

        Everybody talks about John Edwards' energy, intellect and charisma -- Bill Clinton

        by philgoblue on Mon Nov 07, 2005 at 02:23:58 PM PST

        [ Parent ]

        •  yes, it's always propaganda. (none)
          Anyone who homeschools for any reason is inevitably the victim of cult propaganda, in the eyes of the sort of progressive who Knows What's Best for Everyone and intends to make it compulsory.  You seem to have very little tolerance for my family's choice of lifestyle.  So much for diversity.

          I have never let my schooling interfere with my education. -- Mark Twain

          by vinifera on Mon Nov 07, 2005 at 03:19:01 PM PST

          [ Parent ]

          •  One the face of it (none)
            your "Rockefeller and Carnegie" comment shows some serious nuttiness.

            Everybody talks about John Edwards' energy, intellect and charisma -- Bill Clinton

            by philgoblue on Mon Nov 07, 2005 at 06:25:54 PM PST

            [ Parent ]

            •  direct quote (none)
              I told you, they said it all publicly, e.g.:

              "In our dreams, people yield themselves with perfect docility to our molding hands. The present eduction conventions of intellectual and character education fade from their minds, and, unhampered by tradition, we work our own good will upon a grateful and responsive folk. We shall not try to make these people, or any of their children, into philosophers, or men of science. We have not to raise up from them authors, educators, poets or men of letters. We shall not search for great artists, painters, musicians nor lawyers, doctors, preachers, politicians, statesmen - of whom we have an ample supply. The task is simple. We will organize children and teach them to do in a perfect way the things their fathers and mothers are doing in an imperfect way."

              - John D. Rockefeller, General Education Board (1906)

              The General Education Board was a conglomerate of corporate executives who contributed more money to public schooling than did the US government.  In fact, I believe Rockefeller and Carnegie alone contributed more money to public education from 1900 to 1920 than did the government; these two men had immense influence over the design of American education, and they were looking to the economic benefits which had arisen from compulsory schooling of the working classes in parts of Europe.  The industrialists were also influenced by ideas of scientific management, standardization, eugenics, and what one prominent educator called "the better organization of the hive."  The robber barons filled government positions in education with their cronies all along, e.g. William T. Harris:

              "Our schools have been scientifically designed to prevent over-education from happening. The average American [should be] content with their humble role in life, because they're not tempted to think about any other role."

              - William T. Harris, U.S. Commissioner of Education, 1889

              Or Mr. Ellwood Cubberley, Dean of Stanford's School of Education during those Rockefeller / Carnegie years:

              "Our schools are, in a sense, factories, in which the raw products (children) are to be shaped and fashioned into products to meet the various demands of life. The specifications for manufacturing come from the demands of twentieth-century civilization, and it is the business of the school to build its pupils according to the specifications laid down.

              . . .

              Only a system of state-controlled schools can be free to teach whatever the welfare of the State may demand."

              Nutty?  Yes, but not on my part.

              I have never let my schooling interfere with my education. -- Mark Twain

              by vinifera on Mon Nov 07, 2005 at 07:14:36 PM PST

              [ Parent ]

      •  Ug (none)
        Spare  me your homeschooling cult propaganda.,

        Everybody talks about John Edwards' energy, intellect and charisma -- Bill Clinton

        by philgoblue on Mon Nov 07, 2005 at 02:24:09 PM PST

        [ Parent ]

    •  alternative to what? (none)
      public pre-school?

      i have no problem with home-schooling, i think it's great, and better left largely unregulated.

      don't know much about Montessori, but I don't see what the success of that type of school has to do with public pre-school--Montessori they will not be.

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