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View Diary: Steve McMahon (171 comments)

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  •  People don't work for free (none)
    They either get a flat fee - which would be high with no promise of performance - or they work on a percentage basis.

    Republican, Democrat, Conservative, Progressive, Good Consultant, Bad consultant - it's all the same - flat fee or percentage, it's business for God's sake.

    •  But (none)
      When Josh promised them their percentages, they changed their tune and said the campaign was going great.

      "We must all hang together or assuredly we will all hang separately." - Ben Franklin

      by RandyMI on Thu Dec 22, 2005 at 11:52:18 AM PST

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      •  But now what? (none)
        Yeah, but with Leo's untimely demise, what they heck are they going to do?

        I've been wondering how the show is going to handle things now that their VP candidate is no longer available.  Anybody know?

        •  deceased VP (none)
          Haliburton will replace him with a robot.
        •  Supposedly (none)
          they aren't even thinking about it yet.  The show is on a hiatus from taping, and most episodes were already shot.

          I am stumped by this one.  None of the other core characters are realistic as a VP candidate.

          Frankly, I am rooting for a Vinick win.  Make him the "dream" Republican leader in the same way that Barlett was the "dream" Democrat in the waning yeats of the Clinton administration.  Maybe have the Congress go Democratic so that some of the regulars can stick around by being the opposition.

          Of course, this is all very besides the point.  John Spencer will be missed.  He was always one of my favorite character actor, and by far the guy on the show I liked most.

          If there is anything I have learned from Scooby Doo, it is that the only thing to fear is crooked real estate developers.

          by JakeC on Thu Dec 22, 2005 at 01:05:48 PM PST

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          •  If Vinick wins....... (none)
            Vinick seems like a moderate Democrat...so if Vinick wins...Peoplemight associate Republican Party with Democratic Party platform.

            Stop Corporate Influence; buy DEMOCRACY BONDS!!! http://www.democrats.org/democracybonds.html

            by timber on Thu Dec 22, 2005 at 09:22:04 PM PST

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    •  talex (4.00)
      I did. Worked my ass off. So did many others.

      There is nothing more stimulating than a case where everything goes against you. -- Sherlock Holmes

      by Carnacki on Thu Dec 22, 2005 at 12:16:48 PM PST

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      •  Good On You Mate (none)
        so have I.

        But you are mixing apples and oranges, volunteers and hired guns - and the subject was hire guns...

        but point taken and appreciated.

        •  You are pretty mixed up as well... (none)
          Politics just can't be done that way, certainly not in the current political climate in the US.

          It's certainly not how FDR did it -- those guys were all believers, they just knew to pick smart, effective believers, and there's plenty of them.

          And if you're a principles-is-for-sissies kind of guy and don't believe in all that ends vs. means stuff, it's still just plain stupid and innefective -- or maybe even more so: the Republicans have consistently defeated Democrats by always being willing to go one step further in the nastiness.  A consultant who is compromised with the other side, and expecting future contracts from the other side, simply cannot effectively manage a campaign in this environment.

          --
          Blogs will matter when we act locally: Local Diaries on Daily Kos.

          by miholo on Thu Dec 22, 2005 at 01:07:43 PM PST

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          •  Hm, I don't agree (none)
            The one time Bush got knocked back on his heels was by Cindy Sheehan--who did what she did based on pure principle.

            Martin Luther King, Jr., was another principled opponent of "business as usual" who wouldn't have agreed with the ends justifying the means--which is why he eschewed using violence to obtain his goal.

            You cannot obtain just ends through unjust means.  All of history teaches this.

            History also teaches us that people don't really learn much from history...because they keep doing the same stupid shit again and again.

            Ask yourself:  HOW are you going to say "the Democrats are more principled than Bush" if the Democrats throw principle out the window just to win?  Going for "the win" without considering the means breeds cynicism in the political process and takes away the BEST issue we have--that we are BETTER than the other side.  

            Better meaning more just, more fair.  We can fight hard, but decently, and win.  In fact, a principled fight--upholding what's moral, what's good, and what's legal and Constitutional--is our only hope.

            •  Huh? (none)
              I assume it's not with me that you are disagreeing?...  That's not too different from what I said.

              --
              Blogs will matter when we act locally: Local Diaries on Daily Kos.

              by miholo on Thu Dec 22, 2005 at 04:13:03 PM PST

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            •  You cannot obtain ends through unjust means (none)
              is just about the silliest thing I've heard all week.

              Endearing, but silly.

              Come get lost in our world: www.politicsandletters.com

              by MonkeyDog102 on Thu Dec 22, 2005 at 07:22:48 PM PST

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              •  Yeah, Gandhi and Dr. King (none)
                were silly assholes.  Henry David Thoreau and John Lennon, too.

                Endearing, but silly.

                •  please.... (none)
                  I think non-violence is a beautiful thing, but to say that immoral means never lead to positive ends is just not true. Its a nice thought, I guess, but it isn't the case.

                  Sorry.  

                  Come get lost in our world: www.politicsandletters.com

                  by MonkeyDog102 on Thu Dec 22, 2005 at 07:58:46 PM PST

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                  •  If you mean we can't have war (none)
                    ...then you're wrong.

                    Even the Dalai Lama has said there can be such a thing as "just war" and so did Saint Thomas Aquinas in his Summa Theologicae.

                    But you have to remember that the United States is NOT at war--politics is NOT warfare.  

                    In warfare, the object is to totally demolish and destroy your enemy.  You subjugate him.

                    In politics...well, just remember that after an election is over, whoever wins will have to govern those who voted for the losing candidate and you will all have to live with each other.  Honestly, I don't think the US ever fully healed the wounds left over from its own bloody civil war, and that was 140 years ago!

                    So consider the tactics you are using to "win"--or have you never heard of Pyrrhic victory?  

                    •  The Civil War? (none)
                      Are you saying that abolishing slavery wasn't a moral advance?

                      The C.W. is the perfect example of how really screwed up, even down-right evil, means can lead to results that are clearly ethically and morally desireable. Try and win an election based on calling for a return to slavery - 140 years later, and we have thoroughly eradicated that argument from the national conversation.

                      Sorry. Ends sometimes do justify the means.

                      Come get lost in our world: www.politicsandletters.com

                      by MonkeyDog102 on Fri Dec 23, 2005 at 02:13:02 PM PST

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