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View Diary: Know Your Creationists: Kent Hovind (203 comments)

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  •  I don't really agree about Eisenhower... (none)
    From Wiki:

    The words "under God" were added to the Pledge on 14 June 1954 when then U.S. President Dwight D. Eisenhower signed a bill into law that placed the words "under God" into the pledge. At the time, Eisenhower stated that:

    "From this day forward, the millions of our school children will daily proclaim in every city and town, every village and rural schoolhouse, the dedication of our Nation and our people to the Almighty."

    Not exactly standing up to the religious right of the '50s...

    9/11 didn't change the Constitution!

    by Prof Dave on Sat Dec 31, 2005 at 09:26:31 AM PST

    [ Parent ]

    •  Maybe, maybe. (none)
      I don't know.  I just want to think that somewhere, sometime in my lifetime there's been at least one principled conservative.  Ike had the foresight to warn us of what's going on now in Congress, and he dreaded it.  He was principled.

      I don't know how to take the quote, but I do think you've got a point: it seems pandering, although when you read about him it also seems quite consistent with his beliefs.  I think his experience of the war was that it was a great crusade against evil; for him his role in that war seems to have been built on a religious belief in the correctness of the war.

      But even before he was a politician, he was a politican-general.  So it may well have been pandering.

      Nonetheless, I think it is true that american conservatism was not so rabidly anti-science in those days.  That's something much newer.

      -9.25, -7.54

      Yikes. Good thing I don't have guns.

      by Marc in KS on Sat Dec 31, 2005 at 09:36:42 AM PST

      [ Parent ]

      •  pandering generals (none)
        Read "A Bridge Too Far" and you will see that politial pandering during war cost a lot of lives.

        Disclaimer: No trees were harmed in the sending of this message; however, a significant number of electrons were slightly inconvenienced.

        by mollyd on Sat Dec 31, 2005 at 10:35:06 AM PST

        [ Parent ]

      •  In the Eisenhower days... (none)
        The Republicans did not have to cater to the ignorant Southern racist religious South. Since Nixon, that group has been the key block of their national power.

        That's why in 1980 Bush I had to switch from pro-choice to the anti-abortion position when he ran against Reagan for the Republican Nomination for Predsident.

        Anyone who says he or she votes for the man rather than the Party needs to look at that kind of history. Individuals bend to match the required characteristics of getting nominated in the Party rather than bending the Party to match their personal characteristics.

        Recovering Perfectionist IWDWIC (I Will Do What I Can) - Politics Plus Stuff

        by Rick B on Sat Dec 31, 2005 at 07:59:17 PM PST

        [ Parent ]

      •  it wasn't pandering to the religious right (none)
        That's a considerable misunderstanding of the political framework at the time.  See, e.g.,

        http://www.religioustolerance.org/...

        In 1953, the Roman Catholic men's group, the Knights of Columbus mounted a campaign to add the words "under God" to the Pledge. The nation was suffering through the height of the cold war, and the McCarthy communist witch hunt. Partly in reaction to these factors, a reported 15 resolutions were initiated in Congress to change the pledge. They got nowhere until Rev. George Docherty (1911 - ) preached a sermon that was attended by President Eisenhower and the national press corps on 1954-FEB-7. His sermon said in part: "Apart from the mention of the phrase 'the United States of America,' it could be the pledge of any republic. In fact, I could hear little Muscovites repeat a similar pledge to their hammer-and-sickle flag in Moscow." After the service, President Eisenhower said that he agreed with the sermon. In the following weeks, the news spread, and public opinion grew. Three days later, Senator Homer Ferguson, (R-MI), sponsored a bill to add God to the Pledge. It was approved as a joint resolution 1954-JUN-8. It was signed into law on Flag Day, JUN-14. President Eisenhower said at the time: "From this day forward, the millions of our schoolchildren will daily proclaim in every city and town, every village and rural schoolhouse, the dedication of our nation and our people to the Almighty." 4 With the addition of "under God" to the Pledge, it became both "a patriotic oath and a public prayer...Bellamy's granddaughter said he also would have resented this second change." 3

        The change was partly motivated by a desire to differentiate between communism, which promotes Atheism, and Western capitalistic democracies, which were at least nominally Christian. The phrase "Atheistic Communists" has been repeated so many times that the public has linked Atheism with communism; the two are often considered synonymous. Many consider Atheism as unpatriotic and "un-American" as is communism.

        •  I didn't think I was asserting it was (none)
          pandering to the religious right.  I don't think that in the 1950's there really was a religious right.

          I really don't think it was pandering at all; I believe he was being genuine.

          Putting it in the context of battling godless communism makes me more confident in that belief.

          -9.25, -7.54

          Yikes. Good thing I don't have guns.

          by Marc in KS on Sun Jan 01, 2006 at 05:44:48 AM PST

          [ Parent ]

          •  Prof Dave implied it and you said maybe maybe (none)
            but resisted the charge.  I provided material to support your resistance -- I wasn't saying that you asserted that Eisenhower was pandering to the religious right.
    •  that wasn't the religous right (none)
      it was all about a reaction to "Godless communism".

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