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View Diary: Anti-Gay Baptist Leader Arrested for Soliciting Gay Sex (504 comments)

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  •  While I would love to gloat about this (4.00)
    the fact remains that the world is not just seeing a bigot, but a self-hating bigot, who feels the need to denounce people who are just like himself. And when guys like this get caught, they are always on the down low, acting in the most sleazy fashion because they don't want to get caught. And what does this show to the world? That a lot of gay people are not just sleazy, but liars who believe that who they are is shameful.

    This man is a fellow homosexual and unfortunately he reflects poorly on us.

    All I could hope for is that people will put two and two together and realize that being dishonest and hypocritical is not in the nature of gay people. Rather too many feel compelled to act as such to save face. But I'm probably hoping for too much.

    •  The people who think that gays are sleaze (4.00)
      are taught that in part by self-hating garbage like this guy. So maybe this will make some of them question what they are taught. Probably not, but anything is possible.
    •  well said... (none)
      A perspective that isn't heard that often.

      unfortunatly, I really wanted to gloat but now I just...can't.

      "We ought never to do wrong when people are looking." Twain

      by dougymi on Wed Jan 04, 2006 at 06:22:54 PM PST

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      •  Please, still gloat! (none)
        People like this make the lives of many (not just gays) a living hell. I have no problem gloating.
        •  I agree (none)
          No problem with gloating.. just with lame jokes about some prison rape scenario making him "someone's bitch" though he would like it kinda shit.


          Mitch Gore

          A casual stroll through the lunatic asylum shows that faith does not prove anything.

          by Lestatdelc on Wed Jan 04, 2006 at 06:34:46 PM PST

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          •  I feel the same way (none)
            That's long been a problem on DKos (and in everyday life), but I haven't seen that type of humor in this thread. I hope the jokes I've made haven't come across that way.
            •  Not at all (none)
              Making jokes about his hypocrisy and even lewd jokes about the sex aspect of it is something I even giggle about. It is the idea that prison rape is funny, or that men in the receptive role in male/male sex are "bitches" is where I say, time-out, step back, and realize that isn't nor should it be funny.

              Bad puns, and even jokes of a sexual innuendo nature are not offensive to me, and if it's a good zinger, worth a laugh myself.

              As I said, prison rape, and men who have sex with men being "bitches" is where it suddenly and seriously stops being funny.


              Mitch Gore

              A casual stroll through the lunatic asylum shows that faith does not prove anything.

              by Lestatdelc on Wed Jan 04, 2006 at 06:54:43 PM PST

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          •  prison joke? (none)
            dude....don't exaggerate
            •  Prison joke about male rape (none)
              Not funny.

              So would it be funny if a woman was arrested for prostitution (or anything for that matter) and sent to prison so she could be raped?

              There is nothing funny about it and I sincerely suggest you step back and take a look at it.


              Mitch Gore

              A casual stroll through the lunatic asylum shows that faith does not prove anything.

              by Lestatdelc on Wed Jan 04, 2006 at 06:50:33 PM PST

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              •  I don't know (none)
                It may not be humor, but to take an individual who is in a position of power- especially a position he arrived at while lying, and to put HIM into a position where he is at an ultimate loss of power can be cathartic.  

                I would never wish that sort of thing on anybody, but it is much different than the scenario you are describing in comparison.  Women, especially prostitutes, are never in a position of power.  

              •  can you explain, please (none)
                I'm trying to understand.  The prison-rape jokes have been so commonplace here, before and throughout all the Fitzmas indictments stuff, and they continue anytime a mention is made of prison sentences - several came up in the Abramoff scandal discussions.  I've never found them funny, but at this point I've tuned them out.  Why is this suddenly different?

                Is it because the man in question is actually gay?  Or at least - soliciting gay sex?  

                If so, I can understand where you're coming from.  But please don't criticize posters for continuing in the same theme of humor - tasteless as it may be - that has already been going on for a long time.

                Perhaps some mighty victory is growing in you now. - Mike Finley

                by hrh on Wed Jan 04, 2006 at 07:26:34 PM PST

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              •  wasn't suggesting rape (none)
                but I see your point

                and...where's the pizza?

              •  Once More on the "Bitch" Question (none)
                I thought about this above, and seeing the issue come up again, I guess I have to ask.

                Is it also problematic when a buddy of mine (a militant leftist, by the way) telling me about some guy who has got him worked up, purrs (yes, that's the verb): "Oh I just want to worship him; I want to be his bitch."

                Should I not be laughing?  In doing so, am I perpetuating something problematic?

                Or is this an example of him (re-)claiming language?

                On another note: I have trouble rejoicing about this guy, even the hypocrisy exposed.  I so much want to believe that gay men and our society in general are moving beyond this kind of repression.  I look forward to the day when no one is as confused (I mean, fucked up) as this guy must be about sexuality.  

              •  Mitch ........I thought you went out (none)
                to get the pizza.  

                "He that sees but does not bear witness, be accursed" Book of Jubilees

                by Lying eyes on Wed Jan 04, 2006 at 08:01:14 PM PST

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    •  No (none)
      Really, I don't see it that way at all! I just see a lying, hypocrite.

      I think the more people who are exposed like this shows that gay people are everywhere and that the conventional wisdom is a big fat lie. All of us have character flaws, straights and gays, and this guy has a big character flaw in that he lies about what being gay is. He contributes to the lie, and it is good that he is exposed.

      Well, I just don't know what to say, really, except that this news is good, not bad.

      Say no to hate, bigotry, and the author of the Fed. Marriage Amendment, Marilyn Musgrave. Please donate to Angie Paccione.

      by OLinda on Wed Jan 04, 2006 at 06:35:47 PM PST

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    •  Bad people come in all packages (none)
      This is no different than the abusive husband who makes nice with his wife in public.

      I agree, though, that this could send the message that gay people can stoop to particularly low levels.  But I don't think this guy's parishoners will conclude that first...I think they'll feel betrayed by a religious leader and hopefully be angered by the hypocrisy, before condeming him as a gay.

      That doesn't sound too much more appetizing as a result, I know.  I can say with ease that 90% of my friends are gay.  I don't want anything to hurt them.  But I see a trend here with psycho wingnut fundofascists being outted on a regular basis.

    •  He's not sleazy because he's gay (4.00)
      He's sleazy because he's a holier-than-thou hypocritical fundy, denouncing others for doing openly what he sneaks around to do privately.  That it happens to be gay sex he's sneaking around to do matters only because he's spoken out against gays specifically.  So, don't worry that it reflects poorly on gays, it only refects poorly on fundy evangelists; we have plenty of heterosexual examples as well.
      •  I understand what you're saying (none)
        Of course I see it that way, too. But people see what they want to see and can twist a situation to fit their own agendas.

        While we all see his hypocritical behavior as a reflection of his fundamentalist hypocricy, the fundamentalists see his deceit as a reflection of his homosexuality. Rather than this example shedding light on the flaws in their own thinking, it merely reinforces their prejudices against us.

        I guess the point of my original post was that, no matter how much I love seeing these holier-than-thou assholes being revealed for who they really are, none of it is probably going to register on the other side. We're all reinforcing our own prejudices. I want to gloat, but what will it achieve? No one comes out of this any better and no minds will be changed on the other side. In fact, I only fear the other side will grow more certain in their bigotry.

        •  This news doesn't make them more certain (none)
          of the innocence of the guilty and the guilt of the innocent, their own utter irrationality does, and there's nothing we can do about that.  So be reassured, those "made more certain" are the slenderest minority of religious folks, and no matter how vocal they become to try to seem more influential, their spittle-flecked invective convinces no one not already convinced and disgusts many fellow Christians(almost as much as yet another example of fundy hypocrisy); except with the fundiest of fundies, this only hurts their reputations, even with people who might otherwise be expected to agree with them.
    •  Hi John. (none)
      I like what you said, but...

      This sad pathetic hypocrite doesn't reflect anything on me.  I feel bad for him and people like him (the Ennis DelMars of today, for sure).  His dishonesty is probably a reflection of a lifetime of denial and shame, and those things are really difficult for some people to overcome.  Yeah, it's gross what he did, but I'm hopeful that anyone with half a brain can differentiate between that and what 'out' folk like yourself do every day.

      I think this shows the world, more than anything, that our society is so twisted and oppressive in spots that people like this guy still feel they have to resort to such wretchedness to be able to have contact with another person and be who they really are.  It sucks.

      But this also makes me think about straight guys who pick up hookers and go to no-tell motels--if this guy was straight, would it have even made the news?  I dunno.

    •  You got it wrong (none)
      It reflects correctly on Babtist ministers :-)

      American Engineer :== loser!

      by jnmorgan on Thu Jan 05, 2006 at 09:22:00 AM PST

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