Daily Kos

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  •  As Armando noted at length ... (none / 0)

    ...last night in his Diary, Digby over at Hullaballoo has a terrific analysis of the South. Already we barely have a difference between NeoImps and DemoWimps in foreign policy, if we're going to keep edging up to the Republicans year after year, why not just merge altogether?

    I am an anti-imperialist. I am opposed to having the eagle put its talons on any other land. -- Mark Twain

    by Meteor Blades on Tue Nov 09, 2004 at 10:47:29 AM PDT

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    •  Yeah, the Repocrats (none / 0)

      Is it me or these guys are still fighting the Civil War? or some such?

      by Italtransit on Tue Nov 09, 2004 at 10:49:47 AM PDT

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    •  Digby is dead-on (4.00 / 2)

      I'm far from a seasoned political expert, but in the aftermath of this election people seem to be getting about 50% of the lesson right.  Sure, we need to sell our ideas better in certain parts of the country.  What we don't need is to abandon our ideas for neo-GOP ideas that we think are "winners" in any given election cycle.  That's what's lost us the last three national elections.  The so-called values voters will smell the calculation a mile away, anyway.  People can always tell when someone's hawking something he doesn't believe in.  

      And if we do win, then what?  Move left, alienate the voters we converted, and get tossed out on the next go-round?  Or follow through with the center-right agenda we promised but don't actually agree with?  Either way, what was the point of winning via selling out?

      The power of accurate observation is commonly called cynicism by those who have not got it. --George Bernard Shaw

      by Categorically Imperative on Tue Nov 09, 2004 at 10:56:00 AM PDT

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      •  Hmm (none / 0)

        The political calculation thing seems to be working fairly well for the Republicans.

        Maybe we should start calling them on it?

        (0.00,-3.13) "I may disagree with what you have to say, but I shall defend, to the death, your right to say it."

        by Steve4Clark on Tue Nov 09, 2004 at 11:03:44 AM PDT

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        •  What calculation? (none / 0)

          They actually believe all that garbage.  The calculation part is in the negative ads, the smattering of wedge issues, the race-, woman-, gay-baiting, etc.  On the issues, they believe it all: tax cuts, destroying Social Security, preemptive war, hatred of the UN and especially France, all of it.  

          Their only calculation wrt the issues is in framing the steaming pile of excrement that is their set of policies and making it look like a Christmas present, all wrapped up with a pretty bow on top.

          The power of accurate observation is commonly called cynicism by those who have not got it. --George Bernard Shaw

          by Categorically Imperative on Tue Nov 09, 2004 at 11:08:10 AM PDT

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          •  Calculation (none / 0)

            As far as calculation goes, he means things like the Medicare bill, No Child Left Behind Act, etc.  Yes we rightfully criticize those efforts because they didn't go far enough, helped drug companies, weren't properly funded, etc.  But they were calculated attempts by Bush to neutralize Democratic issues, and largely they worked with voters.  He got away with collaborating with Ted Kennedy on an education bill and seeming like he honestly was trying to work with Democrats to help kids.

            Obviously Bush and those Repug a--holes didn't want to help anyone but themselves.  But he did successfully blunt some of our issues.  We should do the same with them ... and we did, when Clinton was in office.  Remember the COPS program to put 100,000 cops on the street?  That was all about neutralizing a Republican issue, and it worked.

            by Philosopher on Tue Nov 09, 2004 at 11:21:26 AM PDT

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          •  Have you not been paying attention? (none / 0)

            The Republicans don't believe all that garbage, until they are told so by their email distribution list.

            Watch 'em... some of these issues don't become issues until Rove/Bush brings them up... and then suddenly they are rabidly behind them.

            The Iraq war was their biggest political calculation, and it worked for them.

            (0.00,-3.13) "I may disagree with what you have to say, but I shall defend, to the death, your right to say it."

            by Steve4Clark on Tue Nov 09, 2004 at 11:30:29 AM PDT

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            •  Not Repug voters (none / 0)

              Repug leaders (Bush and Rove) believe it.  And GOP voters fall in line because of the "strong and steady" leadership.  Any calculation behind it is backed up by belief, which the voters like.  They'd rather have "strong and wrong" blah blah blah.  The suggestion that we should have a leader(s) who panders to a particular constituency/geographic region by taking stances he/she thinks will win by getting to the elusive 270 is precisely the problem with the Democratic Party.

              The power of accurate observation is commonly called cynicism by those who have not got it. --George Bernard Shaw

              by Categorically Imperative on Tue Nov 09, 2004 at 11:34:58 AM PDT

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            •  Party & lib hate > ideology (none / 0)

              They'll shift w/ the wind ideologically.  It's mostly about winning and spiting libs.  They're petty people.

              by ModerateLiberalCA on Tue Nov 09, 2004 at 11:40:36 AM PDT

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