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View Diary: Pentagon has called WP a "chemical weapon" (239 comments)

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  •  Thanks for listening. (none)
    First off, thanks for listening. You have a front-page voice here; I urge you to consider what I have to say.

    Let's say it's not a chemical weapon. Great, then we're merely using "incendiaries" over a city with a known remaining civilian population. Great, we're fuckin' heros.

    Indeed. The tack to take with this, in my opinion, is "our boys dropped fire on civilians, and burned them to death".

    The reality of the situation is horrible enough. It does not need embellishment. Notice how little we've heard about Bush's National Guard service since some twit decided that the story could use a little push, and faked up those memos? Stick to absolutely indisputable truth. The story doesn't need to be sexed up.

    I don't give a rat's ass, personally, whether we call it a chemical weapon or not.

    Good. Don't. It's a weak claim, and gives your opponent an easy out.

    But it is highly instructive that the Pentagon claimed it was, in making a case against Saddam, while they are denying it when used by our forces.

    That's weak. The WMD claims against Saddam centered on the massacre at Halabja, and the use of nerve agents and mustard gases, which are universally recognized as chemical weapons, as WMD. (See the Chemical Weapons Convention.)

    The story here is not definitive proof that WP is considered by the Pentagon to be a chemical weapon, despite people finding these additional citations to back up such an argument. The story here is that they're either lying about it now, or they were lying about it back then. It's cut and dried.

    Luckily, as the people asking, we simply get to ask "when were you lying, then or now?"  I'll be interested in hearing the answer.

    For that argument--chock full of delicious irony, I agree--to work, you need two things. (a) White phosphorus was used against civilian targets by Saddam's forces. (b) The United States government decried the specific use of white phosphorus. Optional but very powerful is a third: (c) the United States government used it as a rationale for the invasion.

    If you cannot prove all three of those in an airtight fashion, I urge you to make your stand on the fact that civilized nations, via the Convention on Certain Conventional Weapons, declare the use of incendiaries on civilians to be a savage and horrible thing. Feel free to point out that the United States is not a signatory to Article III of that treaty, which covers incendiaries, and ask why it's vital to our national security that we set fire to civilians. I mean, clearly we don't outlaw it via treaty, and we're okay with it when our soldiers do it. How much more approval can there be?

    This is an important story. Please tell it as it is. Tell only what you can be absolutely sure about. That idea of unimpeachable integrity that was bandied about when the indictments were flying fast and furious? This is where it starts.

    Thanks for listening, and good luck.

    •  Thank you for a clear statement (4.00)
      To elaborate your point:

      The debate over the term "chemical weapon" has distracted from the reality of burning children to death. Worse, winning the debate -- stretching the term -- would confuse issues that we need to keep clear.

      To illustrate the problem, let's substitute one incendiary for another in the boxed remarks at the head of this post:

      [Gasoline] is a poison which can be absorbed through skin contact, ingestion, or breathing. If its combustion occurs in a confined space, [gasoline] will remove the oxygen from the air and render the air unfit to support life. Long-term absorption, particularly through the lungs and the gastrointestinal tract, can cause chronic poisoning...
      All this is as true of gasoline as it is of white phosphorous. The post goes on to say this about white phosphorous:

      Long-term absorption, particularly through the lungs and the gastrointestinal tract, can cause chronic poisoning, which leads to weakness, anemia, loss of appetite, gastrointestinal weakness, and pallor.

      But this is true of gasoline:

      Symptoms of intoxication by ingestion of gasoline can range from vomiting, vertigo, drowsiness and confusion to loss of consciousness, convulsions, hemorrhaging of the lungs and internal organs, and death due to circulatory failure.

      These descriptions seem too similar.

      Calling toxic incendiaries "chemical weapons" equates nerve gas and gasoline. It trivializes the concept of WMD. In a way, it also trivializes burning children alive by suggesting that what really matters is the fuel used to apply flames to flesh.

      •  Hear, Hear! (none)
        I hate having to post repeatedly about the meaning behind a WEAPON OF MASS DESTRUCTION.  It's a big frickin' deal.  WP is not a WMD.  I want to see this administration held accountable for the horrors and atrocities they have caused/created as much as anyone, and the use of WP on an unarmed populous is horrifying.  

        But no matter how much you want to make that soundbite, WP is not a WMD (or chemical weapon) and it only cheapens the concept of the "reality-based" community that we espouse ourselves to be when we try to stretch the truth to fit our political aims.

        "If everyone is thinking alike, someone isn't thinking." -George S. Patton

        by vmibran on Tue Nov 22, 2005 at 05:25:37 AM PST

        [ Parent ]

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