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  •  Spitzer and You (3.77 / 9)

    So, he disagreed with you about the project and the degree to which this development will benefit the surrounding area -- and the gall to ask if you had an alternate plan -- so you write up this hit piece with precious little in the way of hard facts or actual statements by the Governor? One wonders how much of the attitude displayed in your diary was displayed during your meeting with Mr Spitzer, and what the effect of that was.

    I have no doubt that you have evidence or statistics regarding this land deal, and Mr Spitzer has his, and there's some room for debate there. It looks like your group has a great many questions that need to be answered and points that are undeniable. But this diary absolutely tanks in the persuasion department. You just come off bitter and spiteful, and Spitzer comes off as a person to be sympathized with for the butting of heads he dealt with today.

    Try re-writing your diary with a little backhistory or some facts, and slightly less vitriolic mudslinging, and maybe we'll start to think about Spitzer's true persona. Until then, we've no reason to trust you or your overheated ranting over our own experience and eyes, and we've no reason to think your cause is important since you haven't told us anything about it in relation to Spitzer.

    (-2.75, -4.92) | Hillary isn't the opponent anymore.

    by Addison on Thu May 05, 2005 at 06:48:58 PM PDT

    •  wrong (none / 0)

      We do have an alternative plan with developers interested. we told him. he ignored it. don't talk about something that you did not witness. if you read the diary through, you'd see that I said I'd have been fine if we simply disagreed, but that is not what happened. He came in from the start, angry and imperious and unwilling to engage in any kind of meaningful dialogue at all.

      I don't know about you. but the contender to the throne of NYState has GOT to be concerned about a 2 billion dollar public expenditure on a private for profit development. But he simply wasn't.

      I guess you are the kind that likes being shit on, pissed on, run roughshod on and then say "thank you sir, yes sir, thank you sir."

      I thought it would be an honor and a pleasure to meet the guy. Instead he treated us with utter contempt and disdain. I find it hard to believe its the first time he's done this to anyone.

      Mr. Spitzer doesn't have his statistics. if he did, he'd be willing to engage in a discussion. instead he engaged in a stiff arm.

      We entered the meeting ready for a conversation. He entered the meeting ready to tell us that he is the man with the power and that we just need to shut up and listen.

      And that is just it, Spitzer doesn't have any say over this project. He has no reason to come out on it one way or the other. But he decided to call it "spectacular" based on not one shred of evidence or reasoning.

      you want to know details on the Ratner project. go to the links i posted. this diary, you are correct, was a rant about a politician who pretends he's one thing and is something else. go the links, they are full of facts.

      please tell me, what is so great about Spitzer besides that he is a showy wrist-slapper?

      Know all your enemies. We know who our enemies are. Stop Eminent Domain Abuse. End Corporate Welfare

      by BrooklynBoy on Thu May 05, 2005 at 06:57:53 PM PDT

      [ Parent ]

      •  Please (4.00 / 2)

        Please do not ignore the AG's important work on behalf of some of the most defenseless and exploited New Yorkers, poor immigrant men who earned less than $2 an hour delivering groceries. Spitzer helped win millions of dollars in back pay for these people.

        These are people who have no constituency, no voting power, no politicians in their pocket, no lobby, nothing. Yet Spitzer's labor bureau has worked tirelessly on their behalf. There is no grandstanding here, no showmanship, no flashy headlines to be made, no magazine covers, for cases like these.

        But they do correct a wrong, the kind of wrong which is all too often overlooked. And Spitzer, and the attorneys who work for him, deserve untainted credit for pursuing them.

        Swing State Project: Campaign & Election News

        by DavidNYC on Thu May 05, 2005 at 07:06:05 PM PDT

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      •  Spitzer (none / 0)

        Look, I'm sure that Spitzer can be an ass. Pretty much anyone in New York politics who gets as far as he has must have some sharp elbows.

        And I don't know the details of your conversation, so I won't comment on it. However, Spitzer has done far, far more than slap some companies on the wrist.

        Major corporations actually live in fear of the man, and long-standing practices which are unethical/illegal have stopped, most without ever having been prosecuted. The insurance industry and financial industry, in particular, have changed markedly because of Spitzer, and for the better. I suspect you don't really know about these changes, or don't understand them. You really have to in order to deny that he's made a real difference.

        Here's what a progressive working in health insurance sounds like.

        by jd in nyc on Thu May 05, 2005 at 07:12:20 PM PDT

        [ Parent ]

      •  Are you using exact quotes? (none / 0)

        When you say that Spitzer said this or that you are not using quotation marks. This leads me to believe that perhaps you are characterizing what he said through a veil of anger on this particular issue in your own back yard. I understand your anger and frustration at being up against a man like Spitzer. I don't however give much weight to your rant. Perhaps your personal self interest on this issue clouds your reporting of the facts.

        Infidels in all ages have battled for the rights of man, and have at all times been the advocates of truth and justice... Robert Ingersol

        by BMarshall on Thu May 05, 2005 at 07:18:16 PM PDT

        [ Parent ]

        •  direct quote (none / 0)

          Mr. Spitzer, aren't you concerned that the local elected officials and the city council will have NO say at all on the biggest project every proposed in the borough of Brooklyn?

          His exact answer, "No, I don't care."

          ---
          Its not a back yard issue when city and state taxpayers are being asked for 2 billion dollars.

          Its not a back yard issue when the entire City Council is bypassed.

          Its not a backyard issue when eminent domain is abused.

          Its not a backyard issue when an entire neighborhood is slated for decimation.

          Its not a backyard issue when asthma rates will be increased by development of this scale.

          It is not a backyard issue when national chain stores are subsidized to out compete local businesses.

          It is not a backyard issue when a city is being asked to pay for a losing venture like a sports arena by subidizing NBA salaries.

          These are citywide, statewide and nationwide issues.

          Know all your enemies. We know who our enemies are. Stop Eminent Domain Abuse. End Corporate Welfare

          by BrooklynBoy on Thu May 05, 2005 at 07:28:16 PM PDT

          [ Parent ]

      •  Spitzer and You, Part II (none / 0)

        I don't care one way or another about Spitzer, actually. I did call him the Governor pre-emptively in the above, but that was supposed to be future Governor, so don't read Spitzer worship into that slipup. I think probably you're right about the development plan (if only because huge complexes are bound to be less egalitarian than small brownhouses or whatever) and probably Spitzer was a bit of an ass or too short-tempered with you.

        That said, and as I said, this diary will persuade no one. You can't expect people to go to your site, and you certainly can't expect them to stay there and have their retinas burnt out by the color scheme. Put some facts into the hit piece, then say "Spitzer didn't answer this point" (having given the point w/ stats or facts), and they you'll have a persuasive diary.

        (-2.75, -4.92) | Hillary isn't the opponent anymore.

        by Addison on Thu May 05, 2005 at 07:18:40 PM PDT

        [ Parent ]

      •  You said: (none / 1)

        "don't talk about something that you did not witness"

        Okay then...so, why did you post this diary?  Were only Kossacks who were at the meeting and/or agree with you supposed to comment on this thread?  I must have missed the memo...

        by ZanderOC on Thu May 05, 2005 at 08:28:17 PM PDT

        [ Parent ]

    •  oh, here is a direct quote (none / 0)

      Mr. Spitzer, aren't you concerned that the local elected officials and the city council will have NO say at all on the biggest project every proposed in the borough of Brooklyn?

      His exact answer, "No, I don't care."

      fantastic! thats the kind of good government and transparency and democracy I'd expect, from, well George W. Bush.

      Know all your enemies. We know who our enemies are. Stop Eminent Domain Abuse. End Corporate Welfare

      by BrooklynBoy on Thu May 05, 2005 at 07:03:46 PM PDT

      [ Parent ]

    •  No one should be getting any government money (none / 0)

      to build anything (other maybe than the new WTC towers) in Manhattan or Brooklyn right now.

      Even in the parts that are a bit sketchy, prices are outrageously high.

      Even if Ratner would be getting subsidies partly to build affordable housing, I think that's basically a scam. I think the best way to create affordable housing is to persuade rich people to move to nice new houses and leave nice old hand-me down houses for poor people.

      Housing built specifically for poor people is usually pretty awful.

      So, OK, maybe the original poster should have gone to the meeting equipped with more data, but I think any project like this should be presumed guilty until proven innocent.

      by sclminc on Thu May 05, 2005 at 11:58:31 PM PDT

      [ Parent ]

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