Daily Kos :: Comments Charisma wins elections

she's not a warmonger (8+ / 0-)

Recommended by:
Canadian Reader, RickD, sexton, JayBat, denise b, LNK, esquimaux, andydoubtless

she's a war-enabler. She only voted for the war resolution so that she wouldn't look silly after it was all over in 6 weeks after a stunning U.S. victory.

For all her political savy, on of the things I hold against her the most is not having the savy to see that Iraq was going to be a boiling swamp of disaster. She should have seen it coming better, cuz I did.

All extremists are irrational and should be exposed

by SeanF on Wed Feb 06, 2008 at 02:28:32 PM PDT

[ Parent ]
- She voted for an illegal war... (2+ / 0-)
  
  Recommended by:
  RickD, andydoubtless
  
  It was unlawful for Bush to engage in a preemptive attack on a soveriegn nation that had no defense...plain and simple..and she supported it no matter what she may have thought the duration of the war would be..it was an unlawful military engagement..there are international laws that prohibit wanton aggression by the militarily advanced countries upon the defenseless little nations..problem for Iraq was the fact that they had oil...
  
  She knew what she was doing and has never apologized for it because she supported it...
  
  Obama '08
  
  by RubyGal on Wed Feb 06, 2008 at 02:32:00 PM PDT
  
  [ Parent ]
- Everyone did..we orgainzed 50,000 (0+ / 0-)
  
  marchers in Seattle and our protests have been ignored..the women from New Jersey who asked for 9/11 investigations have never been given answers to some of the most basic questions..that silence is like Hillary's silence..
  
  Obama '08
  
  by RubyGal on Wed Feb 06, 2008 at 02:33:45 PM PDT
  
  [ Parent ]
  - well, to me a warmonger (2+ / 0-)
    
    Recommended by:
    JayBat, andydoubtless
    
    initiates wars. Someone who is more passive in their support doesn't get the "monger" label.
    
    This means, I don't think she'd continue the bush doctrine foreign policy if she won. But it also means I won't vote for her in the primaries.
    
    All extremists are irrational and should be exposed
    
    by SeanF on Wed Feb 06, 2008 at 02:35:35 PM PDT
    
    [ Parent ]
    - She wanted to bomb the spit out of Belgrade (0+ / 0-)
      
      during Clinton I.
      
      I know who Obama's veep will be. You can too!
      
      by slaney black on Wed Feb 06, 2008 at 02:38:23 PM PDT
      
      [ Parent ]
      - so did i (1+ / 0-)
        
        Recommended by:
        JayBat
        
        NATO, i.e. 19 countries all agreed that they needed to solve this problem militarily, as negotiations with Milosovic were impossible. And there was no conquest about this, it was to stop a genocide. So I can't accept this as warmongering.
        
        All extremists are irrational and should be exposed
        
        by SeanF on Wed Feb 06, 2008 at 02:45:42 PM PDT
        
        [ Parent ]
    - I think she would continue the PNAC objectives (0+ / 0-)
      
      Look at her advisers..she has Sandy Berger and Madeleinn Albright there who were happy to drop bombs on humans...
      
      These people are crazy...
      
      Obama '08
      
      by RubyGal on Wed Feb 06, 2008 at 02:44:01 PM PDT
      
      [ Parent ]
      - Huh? (1+ / 0-)
        
        Recommended by:
        SeanF
        
        I truely do not believe anyone who is a thinking person still believes in the PNAC agenda.
        
        Time will Tell all the Truth VT, Virtual Truth
        
        by VirtualTruth on Wed Feb 06, 2008 at 02:46:14 PM PDT
        
        [ Parent ]
        
        You are not paying attention.. (0+ / 0-)
        
        Blackwater USA is a part of the PNAC agenda..
        
        Read Naomi Wolf's book, "The Shock Doctrine"..
        
        Our economic meltdown is a part of the PNAC agenda.
        
        The wall between the USA and Mexico is a part of the PNAC agenda..
        
        Guantanamo is a part of the PNAC agenda..
        
        Homeland Security and the Patriot Act are a part of the PNAC agenda..
        
        We still have deaths of American soldiers in Iraq that was a part of the PNAC agenda..
        
        Really..open your eyes..
        
        Obama '08
        
        by RubyGal on Wed Feb 06, 2008 at 02:56:05 PM PDT
        
        [ Parent ]
        
        Hillary championed this agenda? (1+ / 0-)
        
        Recommended by:
        SeanF
        
        No, And I have been paying attention, long before Mother Jones. Welcome to the party.
        
        Time will Tell all the Truth VT, Virtual Truth
        
        by VirtualTruth on Wed Feb 06, 2008 at 02:58:38 PM PDT
        
        [ Parent ]
        
        Not Hillary, Madeleine Albright (0+ / 0-)
        
        Obama '08
        
        by RubyGal on Wed Feb 06, 2008 at 04:04:20 PM PDT
        
        [ Parent ]
        
        Really? (0+ / 0-)
        
        Maybe I missed her signature on the PNAC Title page.
        I will go back and look for it.
        
        Time will Tell all the Truth VT, Virtual Truth
        
        by VirtualTruth on Wed Feb 06, 2008 at 04:09:27 PM PDT
        
        [ Parent ]
        
        Here you go (0+ / 0-)
        
        This is as cold blooded as you can get.
        
        http://www.youtube.com/...
        
        The PNAC crowd wrote a letter to Clinton in 1998. They had plans to do to Iraq what has been done to Iraq at that time. Clinton knew what was coming. Hillary voted for the war resolution because she supported war against Iraq. She knew what she was voting for because the resolution states what Bush wanted to do. She can't apologize for her vote because she supported and supports Bush to this day.
        
        She will give us more war. And Madeleinne Albright is a foreign policy adviser to Hillary right now...
        
        Obama '08
        
        by RubyGal on Wed Feb 06, 2008 at 04:23:09 PM PDT
        
        [ Parent ]
        
        Youtube, this is your documentation? (0+ / 0-)
        
        How about the title page to the PNAC, did Albright sign this? Was Albright a signator of the letter to Clinton in 1998?
        
        Time will Tell all the Truth VT, Virtual Truth
        
        by VirtualTruth on Wed Feb 06, 2008 at 04:33:27 PM PDT
        
        [ Parent ]
        
        This is certainly Madeleinne in her own words (0+ / 0-)
        
        and you have to admit that she is as cold blooded a wretch as the get.
        
        Obama '08
        
        by RubyGal on Wed Feb 06, 2008 at 04:36:07 PM PDT
        
        [ Parent ]
        
        Advisors are not Presidents (0+ / 0-)
        
        Hillary is not Bush, she will call the shots, not a Carl Rove. Hillary will listen to a balanced argument both pro and con about actions to take both domestic and international.
        
        Sorry I realize I am a creature of debate boards.
        
        Time will Tell all the Truth VT, Virtual Truth
        
        by VirtualTruth on Wed Feb 06, 2008 at 04:41:27 PM PDT
        
        [ Parent ]
        
        This is interesting...she is a signatory to PNAC (0+ / 0-)
        
        This will show you what I am talking about...she is a signatory to PNAC..so stuff it...you Hillary supporter you..and his name is Karl..
        
        http://www.newamericancentury.org/...
        
        Obama '08
        
        by RubyGal on Wed Feb 06, 2008 at 05:11:36 PM PDT
        
        [ Parent ]
        
        Signers of the 1998 PNAC letter to Clinton (0+ / 0-)
        
        Elliott Abrams Richard L. Armitage William J. Bennett
        
        Jeffrey Bergner John Bolton Paula Dobriansky
        
        Francis Fukuyama Robert Kagan Zalmay Khalilzad
        
        William Kristol Richard Perle Peter W. Rodman
        
        Donald Rumsfeld William Schneider, Jr. Vin Weber
        
        Paul Wolfowitz R. James Woolsey Robert B. Zoellick
        
        http://www.newamericancentury.org/...
        
        Nope I don't see her name. I do see a lot of Bush's cabinet as signers however.
        
        Time will Tell all the Truth VT, Virtual Truth
        
        by VirtualTruth on Wed Feb 06, 2008 at 04:36:44 PM PDT
        
        [ Parent ]
        
        Why would she sign a letter to Bill Clinton (0+ / 0-)
        
        with the PNAC crowd when she was the recipient of their advise..??
        
        Really, you look kind of silly supporting fascists and calling yourself a Democrat..
        
        http://www.newamericancentury.org/...
        
        Obama '08
        
        by RubyGal on Wed Feb 06, 2008 at 05:26:55 PM PDT
        
        [ Parent ]
      - then i guess we are very different (0+ / 0-)
        
        cuz if you think PNAC and Albright are the same thing, we live on different planets.
        
        But I get why you think Hillary is a warmonger now!
        ;)
        
        All extremists are irrational and should be exposed
        
        by SeanF on Wed Feb 06, 2008 at 02:47:01 PM PDT
        
        [ Parent ]
        
        Albright knew that Iraqi children were starving (0+ / 0-)
        
        to death during the 1990's when we imposed sanctions on that defensless country..Hussein was no threat..she says he was contained..well they contained him by keeping his country an open prison..people have been so beaten there.
        
        PNAC came about because Bush 41 would not invade Iraq knowing it would be a quagmire..Cheney said so at the time..
        
        PNAC is about empire..everything that comes out of Albrights mouth is about American empire..
        
        Obama '08
        
        by RubyGal on Wed Feb 06, 2008 at 02:59:43 PM PDT
        
        [ Parent ]
        
        i think you are nuts (0+ / 0-)
        
        in a way. If you want to use Pax Americanus as code language for empire, then I'd say that the Albrights are more about benevolent empire, the PNACs are about domination and forcing people to be like us, i.e. evil empire. Are either sustainable? I don't think so; we need something truly different. But if you can't tell the HUGE distinctions between those two, then I take your judgement less seriously.
        
        And btw, who do you support this cycle? Do you really think Obama (whom I support) will be that much different foreign policy wise? I don't think anyone running is suggesting we transfer American empire power to an international governance scheme that has glocal input. That's what I'd do, but I'm not expecting any candidate to pull that off quite yet.
        
        All extremists are irrational and should be exposed
        
        by SeanF on Wed Feb 06, 2008 at 03:04:52 PM PDT
        
        [ Parent ]
        
        She was not about benevolent empire.. (0+ / 0-)
        
        She is not about benevolent empire..she is about empire and the power and might of the USA...That is Neocon to me..that is what PNAC is all about..
        
        Obama '08
        
        by RubyGal on Wed Feb 06, 2008 at 04:03:21 PM PDT
        
        [ Parent ]
        
        you need to get you vocabulary sorted (0+ / 0-)
        
        i can't discuss these things with you when you decide what labels and words mean "to you" willy nilly.
        
        All extremists are irrational and should be exposed
        
        by SeanF on Wed Feb 06, 2008 at 04:13:03 PM PDT
        
        [ Parent ]
        
        Obviously you are a hostile idiot (0+ / 0-)
        
        I see so many people like you here. It gets so tiresome.
        
        Obama '08
        
        by RubyGal on Wed Feb 06, 2008 at 04:25:02 PM PDT
        
        [ Parent ]
        
        i was trying to be nice actually (0+ / 0-)
        
        but you tire me too, so we're even.
        
        All extremists are irrational and should be exposed
        
        by SeanF on Wed Feb 06, 2008 at 04:43:47 PM PDT
        
        [ Parent ]
        
        Madeleine Albright is a signatory to PNAC (0+ / 0-)
        
        but then again .. so is Joe Biden..very curious.. and look at the date..my my..
        
        http://www.newamericancentury.org/...
        
        Obama '08
        
        by RubyGal on Wed Feb 06, 2008 at 05:14:26 PM PDT
        
        [ Parent ]
        
        nice catch (0+ / 0-)
        
        actually, it's a letter, not an indication of membership. but nice catch nonetheless.
        
        All extremists are irrational and should be exposed
        
        by SeanF on Wed Feb 06, 2008 at 05:28:03 PM PDT
        
        [ Parent ]
        
        Joe Biden is on this also... (0+ / 0-)
        
        which is curious..and the date is curious also..but what is really interesting is that a person with the last name of Bao Lord is a signatory to one other of these PNAC documents and she is in the FEC filings for Hillary's campaign fundraising..very curious..
        
        Obama '08
        
        by RubyGal on Wed Feb 06, 2008 at 05:30:16 PM PDT
        
        [ Parent ]
        
        well what's hard to tell (0+ / 0-)
        
        is what implication do these letters have? Why would anyone on the left want to be on any of these letters? I mean, the content of the letter was fine, I agree with it. But the letterhead you'd think would give one pause...
        
        That being said, are you a fan of Zbigneiw Brzinzksky? (spelling is wrong) He's one of Obama's top foreign policy advisors and is a longstanding center left hawk. I happen to love him, but given some of his stances, wonder if you'd consider him a PNAC lover too??
        
        All extremists are irrational and should be exposed
        
        by SeanF on Wed Feb 06, 2008 at 05:35:58 PM PDT
        
        [ Parent ]
        
        Well...I think he has written some unfortunate (0+ / 0-)
        
        things..but he was also stating very clearly in the Carter administration that we had to move full speed ahead on alternative fuels because he correctly predicted the mess we are in now. Carter wanted to have this country work on energy with great vigor. Now we are behind the rest of the world when we could have been at the forefront of alternatives.
        
        Reagan came in and the PNAC people saw this as the opportunity to push their agenda way back then..The Council for National Policy was formed by Rich DeVos..Jerry Falwell and Pat Robertson ushered in the Evangelical political power needed to give the right wing election wins..and George Herbert Walker Bush started on his ambitious project to create black ops money by trafficking in drugs and weapons..that was what BCCI was about.
        
        I don't know how Barack will be..but I surely do not want Hillary. It is the cold bloodedness of these people that is shocking..
        
        Obama '08
        
        by RubyGal on Thu Feb 07, 2008 at 06:34:08 AM PDT
        
        [ Parent ]

View Story | 54 comments

Daily Kos Help

she's not a warmonger (8+ / 0-)

She voted for an illegal war... (2+ / 0-)

Everyone did..we orgainzed 50,000 (0+ / 0-)

well, to me a warmonger (2+ / 0-)

She wanted to bomb the spit out of Belgrade (0+ / 0-)

so did i (1+ / 0-)

I think she would continue the PNAC objectives (0+ / 0-)

Huh? (1+ / 0-)

You are not paying attention.. (0+ / 0-)

Hillary championed this agenda? (1+ / 0-)

Not Hillary, Madeleine Albright (0+ / 0-)

Really? (0+ / 0-)

Here you go (0+ / 0-)

Youtube, this is your documentation? (0+ / 0-)

This is certainly Madeleinne in her own words (0+ / 0-)

Advisors are not Presidents (0+ / 0-)

This is interesting...she is a signatory to PNAC (0+ / 0-)

Signers of the 1998 PNAC letter to Clinton (0+ / 0-)

Why would she sign a letter to Bill Clinton (0+ / 0-)

then i guess we are very different (0+ / 0-)

Albright knew that Iraqi children were starving (0+ / 0-)

i think you are nuts (0+ / 0-)

She was not about benevolent empire.. (0+ / 0-)

you need to get you vocabulary sorted (0+ / 0-)

Obviously you are a hostile idiot (0+ / 0-)

i was trying to be nice actually (0+ / 0-)

Madeleine Albright is a signatory to PNAC (0+ / 0-)

nice catch (0+ / 0-)

Joe Biden is on this also... (0+ / 0-)

well what's hard to tell (0+ / 0-)

Well...I think he has written some unfortunate (0+ / 0-)

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