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  •  I kinda blame the (0+ / 0-)

    traffickers.  Call me old-fashioned.

    •  For? (1+ / 0-)

      Recommended by:
      imchange

      You mean shooting each other?  Congratulations!

      If there were no market incentive to traffick those drugs, maybe they wouldn't be doing it?

      The irony is Michelle's story only happens in America, according to its most fervent patriots. Cindy McCain's happens in any country with concentrated wealth.

      by Nulwee on Sun Apr 27, 2008 at 07:46:36 AM PDT

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      •  Seriously. (0+ / 0-)

        I am neutral about drug legalization.  But when greedy traffickers start shooting each other in Tijuana, I tend to blame the greedy traffickers.

        I know.  Silly.

        •  Wow (3+ / 0-)

          Recommended by:
          Dave925, kulshan, imchange

          So you help destroy your neighbor's economic prosperity in manifold ways, then create a giant economic vacuum by outlawing products which they can easily and economically will produce.  It's totally predictable.  Action and consequence.

          You see, some of us without our moral pretension would prefer to see all murder and carnage cease.  

          Rather than create a false debate over the gang members being moral agents (when you don't even know if all of them were engaged in shooting, some of them could have been shot without being armed or firing) when I never said they weren't, you'd rather assume this is some sort of exception to a pattern that ultimately leads back to Mexico City and Washington.

          Governments see patterns or at least create patterns.  I'd prefer ones that don't end in ignorance and murder. Whatever form. Your's or their's.

          The irony is Michelle's story only happens in America, according to its most fervent patriots. Cindy McCain's happens in any country with concentrated wealth.

          by Nulwee on Sun Apr 27, 2008 at 07:54:28 AM PDT

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        •  Criminals control the drug trade (3+ / 0-)

          Recommended by:
          Dave925, Nulwee, kulshan

            because the drug trade is illegal. If drugs were legal criminals would not control the drug trade.

            Blaming drugs for this violence is misguided. The opportunity to make large amounts of tax-free cash is created by the drug war. The meme that drugs somehow automatically cause violent, criminal behavior is one of the chief talking points of the anti-drug zealots whose tireless work keeps this farce going.

            Decriminalization would leave this situation unchanged. Drug trafficing would still be illegal, and all the problems that attend would still exist.

          What's the difference between Vietnam and Iraq? Bush knew how to get out of Vietnam.

          by happy camper on Sun Apr 27, 2008 at 08:23:20 AM PDT

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          •  I agree, except one point.... (2+ / 0-)

            Recommended by:
            Nulwee, bugscuffle

            Decriminalization would leave this situation unchanged. Drug trafficing would still be illegal, and all the problems that attend would still exist.

            That logic is flawed and can be scene in everyday life.

            What is trafficked more, cocaine or Vicadin??

            Right.

            And which one is legal??

            Right.

            So in fact regulation will bring things under reign, and furthermore, the romanticism that is attached to using drugs would be gone.

            Not much of a rebellious act to do something legal is it?

             

            •  umm, (0+ / 0-)

              Ok, if drugs were legal, the price would probably drop by quite a bit. Suddenly, there wouldn't be nearly as much money to be made selling them illegally, which would in practice probably mean to people who were underage or were too stupid to get the medical marijuana prescription.

              Would you shoot someone for 100 grand?  Most traffickers would.  Would they do it for fifty bucks?  Not likely.  More to the point, they wouldn't have the money to bribe cops and politicians like they do now.  

              Instead of big time dealers, you would have small time dealers and they wouldn't be able to cause nearly as much damage to society.

              This illustrates another problem with having a large part of our borders unprotected.  It isn't just honest laborers coming in.  Some of them are carrying dope.  Some of them are venezuelan special forces types coming in to make sure no airstrikes we might do go unavenged, some of them are probably al quaeda types looking to start something.  Leaving the borders unsecured is STUPID.  

              I am an angry clown. Often pwnt, never owned. The world is a gradeschool playground with no teachers in sight.

              by obnoxiotheclown on Sun Apr 27, 2008 at 01:47:48 PM PDT

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