View Story | 308 comments
Comments: Expand Shrink Hide (Always) | Indented Flat (Always)
Try as you might, you cannot spell HOPE with the letters GOP.
by David Kroning on Thu May 15, 2008 at 07:43:46 AM PDT
by serrano on Thu May 15, 2008 at 07:46:30 AM PDT
[ Parent ]
Try someting with consequences.
Impeach or get off the pot!!
"The meek shall inherit nothing" - F. Zappa
by cometman on Thu May 15, 2008 at 08:46:52 AM PDT
Some people fight fire with fire. Professionals use water.
by Happy Days on Thu May 15, 2008 at 09:43:41 AM PDT
I'm no expert, but it might be that the dems benefit from allowing the Bush administration to slowly bleed right now -- the GOP becomes gradually weaker from self-inflicted wounds as time goes on.
The decision to not impeach him might be tactical.
I do hope he and his cronies have to answer for all of the questionable things they've done during the past seven years. I'll be happy when they are out of power.
John McCain and George W. Bush: Let them eat cake. August 29, 2005.
by rb137 on Thu May 15, 2008 at 10:50:50 AM PDT
because we live in a country based on legal precedent.
by David Kroning on Thu May 15, 2008 at 10:53:09 AM PDT
I really don't know what they need to do. Maybe they haven't approached impeachment because they do not have enough votes -- but otherwise would.
Today, from me, you will get speculation about things that I know nothing about!!! :)
by rb137 on Thu May 15, 2008 at 10:56:09 AM PDT
This are honest questions, because I'm trying to think this through -- I'm not advocating a point of view. I just want to hit the angles.
What is the cost/benefit of impeachment? Suppose we impeached Bush and Cheney, and succeeded in removing them from office. What do we gain?
The presidency then defaults to the Speaker? So Democrats get something, but this has only been true since the last midterm election. They would possibly lose a much needed seat in congress, too. Prior to the last midterm, though, we would not have even turned over parties in the White House. How much would the policies have changed? Would that have saved anyone, caused fewer people to be tortured, ended the war, preserved civil liberties, or helped us economically? I don't know.
I can clearly see the philosophical (moral, ethical, etc.) benefit of impeachment. It would be a shame to attempt this and not be successful, though. Or to be successful at removing Bush but not Cheney. Yikes.
Another question -- what happens after Bush and Cheney have left office? Are they immune then? Only if someone pardons them, right? Is prosecuting them then a plausible course of action?
Is the point of impeachment simply to bring leaders to trial in order so that they can be removed from power? Removal requires a 2/3 majority in both houses of congress?
Criminal proceedings would have to be filed separately, anyway, right?
by rb137 on Thu May 15, 2008 at 02:51:32 PM PDT
Yeah, Democrats were shrewd in leaving Bush "twisting in the wind to make it cheaper and easier for Clinton and the rest of her cowardly Democratic Congressional majority to run against Bush's legacy - just like Clinton got fired from the Watergate investigation for plotting to do with Nixon.
But they screwed us by doing it. They'd have won anyway, probably even more decisively by leading America with impeachment out of this long national nightmare.
Instead, all we'll get is a Democratic trifecta power monopoly with no indication they'll rip out Bush/Cheney's Unitary Executive tyrannies. And all clear signs that they'd never even mention impeachment of one of their own for exercising it.
"When the going gets weird, the weird turn pro." - HST
by DocGonzo on Thu May 15, 2008 at 11:18:05 AM PDT
Or do you think that they didn't have enough votes and didn't devote the resources? Something else?
It seems like a lot of people are champing at the bit to impeach Bush and/or Cheney (I include many of my congressfolk in this group), but it never happens.
by rb137 on Thu May 15, 2008 at 11:26:37 AM PDT
It was pretty obvious that Pelosi "taking impeachment off the table" as she took control of that power, with 2 years to go and 6 seriously impeachable years under the bridge, was a strategic move of some sort. What else could it possibly be? Some faith that Bush would do no more wrong? Some reliance on massive, dramatically reversed legislative action that would have certainly been inadequate, and was never even attempted? No, they had a "no impeachment" strategy, that they literally broadcast from day 1.
That strategy's goal was clearly not to stop Bush. He's continued, obstructing Congress, vetoing them, using his combination with a Republican minority to keep the criminal enterprises - and the war - running. As they surely were certain he would.
But then we learn about Clinton's 1974 strategy to leave Nixon "twisting in the wind", rather than impeach him, to make it cheaper and easier to run Ted Kennedy or some other Democratic candidate against Nixon's legacy in 1976. And we can see that it's precisely the same playout as in 2006-2008. Except this time Clinton is absolutely the presumptive nominee, her husband is the immediately previous Democratic president and on the stump, and this Baby Boomer generation of Democrats has the moral fiber that volunteered in greater numbers for Vietnam than their "Greatest Generation" parents did for WWII. These Democrats colluded with Republicans to keep us trapped in the box with Bush and his plummeting ratings.
And it worked - for the Democratic Party. Democrats will hold a 60:40%+ House majority, and possibly a 60:40%+ Senate majority, with likely a 55:45%+ president young enough to campaign for 20 years after his second term ends.
For America, though, we got 2 years more of Bush and his crimes. Thousands more Americans dead in Iraq, Afghanistan twisting in the wind for more years, the dollar down double digit percentages more, $TRILLIONS mode government debt, the mortgage bankruptcies firmly locked into catastrophe, America's hardwon preeminence further squandered. Benathir Bhutto killed, Putin parading nukes through Red Square, China gloating over an Olympic celebration of mafia tyranny over 2 billion people with no concessions, and how many other devastating crimes?
A huge cost. Democrats aren't so stupid that they paid all that cost (accruing to the country, not so much to themselves) by accident, rather than for their most precious commodity: votes in November 2008.
If Democrats had used their majority to take even the smallest step to roll back all Bush/Cheney's crimes rather than impeach them, we might have some evidence of something else. But these cynical clowns can't even give us a clean kill of the FISA-violating, Constitution-shredding Protect "America" Act, but spend a year waffling and maybe even caving, so America's fear whipped up by Bush is channeled into fearing Bush.
A generation of cowardly swine. If Pelosi's Congress had impeached Bush/Cheney, they'd be long gone by now, and we'd be getting through the end of his replacement. If Democrats had pulled that off with even a modicum of dignity, they'd be heroes now in light of all the new heinous crimes exposed by Bush/Cheney's trials. There would be far less chance for Republican election victories now than in 1976 after Watergate, especially as Watergate would be demonstrated as no aberration, but rather the basic nature of the Republican Party.
And I defy anyone to explain it otherwise, with any facts or evidence. This is crystal clear.
And we have no other future facing us than to be bottled up with that supremely manipulative sellout Democratic Congress, and its trifecta power monopoly starting 2009.
Without the Iraq War blame that gets you caught, but with the Iraq War that gets you paid.
But thankfully at least without the Clinton whose career is bookended by the worst catastrophes in modern America, which for her was just an opportunity to grab more power with the worst complicity.
by DocGonzo on Thu May 15, 2008 at 02:58:58 PM PDT
Nearby, I posted some questions/ideas about impeachment. You might find that comment and give some of those questions a rip.
I haven't thought seriously about impeachment, because it hasn't seemed like a realistic hope. Plenty of Democrats who are in my neck of the woods (Washington) try to raise the issue again and again. In fact, one of our 'impeach Cheney' champions became an Obama superdelegate today.
Not to be daft, but what do you mean precisely by 'trifecta power monopoly'?
Thanks...
by rb137 on Thu May 15, 2008 at 04:21:00 PM PDT
Doesn't John McCain look tired?
by SciVo on Thu May 15, 2008 at 04:52:26 PM PDT
by rb137 on Thu May 15, 2008 at 05:12:38 PM PDT
meanwhile people continue to DIE and the ones who stay alive get poorer and poorer.
I'm sure the decision not to impeach is tactical on the part of the Democrats.
It's also cowardly and it's also wrong.
by cometman on Thu May 15, 2008 at 11:37:07 AM PDT
Cowardly might be spot on. I'll cite that as a definite possibility.
by rb137 on Thu May 15, 2008 at 11:42:36 AM PDT
in every way and at every opportunity the actions of this regime.
We should speak out whether we believe we will be ultimately successful or not. As MlK said, "In the end, we will remember not the voices of our enemies, but the silence of our friends."
Send a letter.
by David Kroning on Thu May 15, 2008 at 11:42:41 AM PDT
by rb137 on Thu May 15, 2008 at 11:45:17 AM PDT
He wants us to speak out.
We should also contact McCain and the media.
John&Cindy McCain:A "Dallas" and "Dynasty" rerun.
by redtex on Thu May 15, 2008 at 11:51:07 AM PDT
One of the biggest Nazi admirers and sympathizers in the US back in the '30s:
On July 23, 2007, the BBC Radio 4 series Document reported on the alleged Business Plot and the archives from the McCormack-Dickstein Committee hearings. The program mentioned [Prescott] Bush's directorship of the Hamburg-America Line, a company that the committee investigated for Nazi propaganda activities, and the alleged 1933 attempt, supposedly led by Gerald MacGuire, to stage a military coup against President Franklin D. Roosevelt aimed at forcing Roosevelt to resign (or, failing that, to assassinate him) and at installing a fascist dictatorship in the United States.
From wiki.
Obama-Feingold '08
by XOVER on Thu May 15, 2008 at 08:49:12 AM PDT
Video here. Pretty blatant.
More. Is it just me - or is McFlightSuit™ looking even more unhinged than usual? Is that Jack Daniels behind him?
Slap it. Shoot it. Kaboot it.
by adios on Thu May 15, 2008 at 09:03:30 AM PDT
you a little of Biff from Back to the Future?
Thou shalt not kill except for a long list of good reasons is like saying you should not covet your neighbor's wife unless she's hot.
by FudgeFighter on Thu May 15, 2008 at 12:37:10 PM PDT
by Tainith on Thu May 15, 2008 at 12:56:20 PM PDT
Tipped and Recc'd as well.
by ZZZzzz on Thu May 15, 2008 at 07:56:19 AM PDT
Done to both Mississippi Senators, not like those fuckers will do anything.
This is a goddamned outrage.
Fuck it. Time for the gloves to come off, NOW.
Get em, Barack! It's you and Chimpy, mano-a-mano! NO MORE MR. NICE GUY! =)
"The thought of McCain being president sends a cold chill down my spine. He is erratic. He is hotheaded. He loses his temper and he worries me." --Thad Cochran
by Initiate Plan B on Thu May 15, 2008 at 08:22:38 AM PDT
this wanker definitely needs pie.
fouls, excesses and immoderate behavior are scored ZERO at Over the Line, Smokey!
by seesdifferent on Thu May 15, 2008 at 08:40:43 AM PDT
byt Mr. Leiberman don't shock anymore. He is effectively a Republican.
If we want peace, why do we give weapons and call it "aid"?
by gdwtch52 on Thu May 15, 2008 at 09:01:05 AM PDT
as a person of the Jewish persuasion he should know better. Nazi isn't a term to throw around lightly.
ROAD2DC ... IGTNT
by snackdoodle on Thu May 15, 2008 at 10:59:06 AM PDT
I both wrote and left a message... I hope she doesnt decide to stay silent about this
The CONSTITUTION is MY Flag pin
by KnotIookin on Thu May 15, 2008 at 08:25:31 AM PDT
and my letter is going out NOW.
And yes, Dick Durbin will get one too.
"Lies return." - African proverb
by Night Train on Thu May 15, 2008 at 08:59:52 AM PDT
It's looking like you've got a new Senator coming soon!
"We the People of the United States..." -U.S.Constitution
by elwior on Thu May 15, 2008 at 10:25:04 AM PDT
We've decided to clone him.
by Fistgrrl on Thu May 15, 2008 at 10:35:39 AM PDT
but he's OURS now!
Barack Obama - I'll never see the threat of terrorism as a way to scare up votes, it's a threat that should rally this country against our common enemies
by madgranny on Thu May 15, 2008 at 11:27:08 AM PDT
Mine are McCain and Kyl. My gut is all of them will stay silent.
"I still say a church steeple with a lightning rod on top shows a lack of confidence" Doug McLeod
by artmartin on Thu May 15, 2008 at 09:11:54 AM PDT
John W. McCain, Bush's third term.
by aaraujo on Thu May 15, 2008 at 09:23:47 AM PDT
Don't forget Schumer.
Then again, don't hold your breath until he follows through.
Hey, Brian Ross! Who Lied To You About the Anthrax?
by tbetz on Thu May 15, 2008 at 10:47:06 AM PDT
should I also write a letter?
"4 months until we change the world!" -Barack Obama
by nklein on Thu May 15, 2008 at 09:45:26 AM PDT
a letter must be read, logged, handled, and filed, and I do believe they are required to send you a response.
by David Kroning on Thu May 15, 2008 at 09:47:16 AM PDT
and stamped. Ready to drop in the mail.
I added an addendum to the letter after the paragraph beginning "President Bush's partisan attakc..."
On a personal note, my grandparents met at a Displaced Persons camp and my father is named for the first president to recognize Israel. My love for Israel is everlasting, not merely due to my Jewish faith and or my family there, but also because my father and mother are the same age as Israel. Thus I look at Israel like a parent. Therefore, when the president used his opportunity to speak in front of the Knesset to attack me and my fellow citizens (many of whom like me have family who died in the Holocaust) was truly distressing. Words fail me in my effort to express how truly disgusted and angered I was by those remarks.
Also, I think Bush made those remarks today. You might want to change you letter to say May, 15 2008.
by nklein on Thu May 15, 2008 at 10:48:32 AM PDT
Your letter KICKS ASS--well-written, succinct, and to the point. :)
I'm borrowing some text for the email to my Senators (Martinez and Bill Nelson of FL). :)
--- BE the movement. Obama for President. ---
by boofdah on Thu May 15, 2008 at 07:56:49 AM PDT
already sent this exact script. Maybe you can change it up a bit so they dont see this as "form letter" :)
by ZZZzzz on Thu May 15, 2008 at 07:59:43 AM PDT
...in the original:
Dear Senator Martinez: I am writing to you today, as a constituent, requesting that you table a motion as soon as possible to censure President George W. Bush for the extraordinary language and words he used in addressing the Israeli Knesset on May 14, 2008 (yesterday). President Bush's partisan attack, which odiously insinuated that the Democratic party, and by extension, American citizens who belong to that party, are like Nazi "appeasers" was both despicable and embarrasing. Though we may have differences of opinion on how to achieve this, all Americans, regardless of political affiliation, want to see our country safeguarded against all enemies, foreign and domestic. I do not believe that either the Republicans or the Democrats have a monopoly on how to achieve this. We must let the record show that such behavior by the Chief Executive of this nation is inexcusable and intolerable. I thank you for your time and consideration of this request. Sincerely, me
Dear Senator Martinez:
I am writing to you today, as a constituent, requesting that you table a motion as soon as possible to censure President George W. Bush for the extraordinary language and words he used in addressing the Israeli Knesset on May 14, 2008 (yesterday).
President Bush's partisan attack, which odiously insinuated that the Democratic party, and by extension, American citizens who belong to that party, are like Nazi "appeasers" was both despicable and embarrasing.
Though we may have differences of opinion on how to achieve this, all Americans, regardless of political affiliation, want to see our country safeguarded against all enemies, foreign and domestic. I do not believe that either the Republicans or the Democrats have a monopoly on how to achieve this.
We must let the record show that such behavior by the Chief Executive of this nation is inexcusable and intolerable.
I thank you for your time and consideration of this request.
Sincerely,
me
by boofdah on Thu May 15, 2008 at 08:05:41 AM PDT
by David Kroning on Thu May 15, 2008 at 08:11:32 AM PDT
Is that the correct parlimentary procedure? I would think that would remove it from discussion. Wouldn't a better choice of words be to "introduce" or "support" a motion?
Perhaps the best way is to say "It is time for the Senate to censure President Bush for his disgraceful statements in Israel. I am asking you to support a censure resolution."
McCain: Straight Talk Express or Blunder Bus?
by lynneinfla on Thu May 15, 2008 at 08:13:50 AM PDT
by David Kroning on Thu May 15, 2008 at 08:14:23 AM PDT
by TampaProgressive on Thu May 15, 2008 at 08:11:23 AM PDT
President Bush may want to take up his head-in-the-sand views with his own Defense Secretary. Just yesterday, Robert Gates said the U.S. needs to "sit down and talk with" Iran:
"We need to figure out a way to develop some leverage...and then sit down and talk with them," Gates said. "If there is going to be a discussion, then they need something, too. We can’t go to a discussion and be completely the demander, with them not feeling that they need anything from us."
Bush’s cross-continental partisan assault upends the traditional notion that U.S. politics should stop "at the water’s edge." Reacting to Bush’s comments, Obama issued this statement: "It is sad that President Bush would use a speech to the Knesset on the 60th anniversary of Israel’s independence to launch a false political attack. It is time to turn the page on eight years of policies that have strengthened Iran and failed to secure America or our ally Israel." and a CNN video of the speach..
by ZZZzzz on Thu May 15, 2008 at 08:07:08 AM PDT
Bush doesn't have the least idea what he's talking about.
by seesdifferent on Thu May 15, 2008 at 08:18:37 AM PDT
I think my head is going to explode.
by Bob Sackamento on Thu May 15, 2008 at 08:53:46 AM PDT
"requesting that you table a motion as soon as possible to censure" needs to be changed to something like "requesting that you make (or enter, or something like that) a motion as soon as possible to censure..."
To table means to take no action and put it on the back burner.
Thanks for this important diary!
Today's mighty oak is just yesterday's nut that held its ground.
by MizC on Thu May 15, 2008 at 08:11:35 AM PDT
by David Kroning on Thu May 15, 2008 at 08:15:04 AM PDT
it means to bring up a bill, not to put it down.
by seesdifferent on Thu May 15, 2008 at 08:21:22 AM PDT
by David Kroning on Thu May 15, 2008 at 08:22:17 AM PDT
for those roots, when facing with this kind of muckapulting of propoganda.
When life gives you wingnuts, make wingnut butter!
by antirove on Thu May 15, 2008 at 11:27:53 AM PDT
http://www.omgili.com/...
"Well, yeah, the Constitution is worth it if you can succeed." -Nancy Pelosi, 6/29/07.
by nailbender on Thu May 15, 2008 at 08:12:12 AM PDT
Investors' Business Daily, not that I'd recommend sending them the traffic.
by nailbender on Thu May 15, 2008 at 08:18:26 AM PDT
Gaza.Bush goes home. But the Israelis stay.Talk is cheap. Peace is better than war.
by Barry Leonardini on Thu May 15, 2008 at 08:43:32 AM PDT
cheap, particularly foreign lives.
by snackdoodle on Thu May 15, 2008 at 11:02:46 AM PDT
Deaf ears.
Can't wait to get rid of Dole.
Happy little moron, Lucky little man.I wish I was a moron, MY GOD, Perhaps I am!-Spike Milligan
by polecat on Thu May 15, 2008 at 08:52:01 AM PDT
Everyone needs to call and email this story, to the traditional media. The hypocrisy is staggering.
http://www.guardian.co.uk/...
WE need to hit back at the truth and show the Repubs that they past will be bought up when they do this.
The definition of insanity is voting the same way and expecting a different result. I'm talking to you FL,OH, KY, WV!
by Shhs on Thu May 15, 2008 at 10:15:11 AM PDT
(Anti-Defamation League) and let them know that they need to speak out against this inappropriate use of Nazi imagery to smear US political opponents!
by batgirl71 on Thu May 15, 2008 at 11:17:29 AM PDT
received the following: Dear Senator Murray:
Earlier, the Senate censured MoveOn.org, for calling General Petraeus, "General Betrayus." I am writing to you today, as a Washington Sate constituent, taxpayer, and voter, requesting that you introduce a formal Senate Censure of President George W. Bush. Because, George Bush, while speaking on foreign soil, has actually betrayed us.
Bush, speaking before the Israeli Knesset insinuated that American's who disagree with his foreign policies and merely express a willingness to talk with People Bush deems enemies are are like Nazi "Appeasers." Calling Americans who disagree with his failed policies, appeasers of Nazis on foreign soil, for purely political gain, before the Israeli Knesset, is outrageous.
Virtually every Bush Foreign Policy declaration of foreign enemies has proven false and without merit. Bush sees enemies where none exist and he insists on killing them, none the less. Bush does not own our Military, or America's response to threats from Terrorism. Although we may have differences of opinion on how to achieve this, all Americans, regardless of political affiliation, want to see our country safeguarded against all enemies, foreign and domestic. We must let the record show that such behavior by the Chief Executive of this nation is inexcusable and intolerable.
I look forward to your name appearing as a sponsor of a formal Senate Censure of George W. Bush. Thank you for your time and consideration of this request.
by leonard145b on Thu May 15, 2008 at 11:31:32 AM PDT
letters: http://www.congress.org/... The writer just has to enter his/her zip code in the box on the left hand side, then on the next page, click on the "Federal" link (below the blue band) and one can choose to send either an email or snail mail letter (for free) to all or a selected group of representatives. I probably made it sound more complicated than it is; it's a really quick and easy service for people to use.
Bush deserves so much more than a mere censure, but it's worth writing anyway, since the "Nazi" comments are so far over the top that...well, I'm speechless, frankly.
"I'm asking you to believe. Not just in my ability to bring about real change in Washington...I'm asking you to believe in yours." - Barack Obama
by Wordie on Thu May 15, 2008 at 11:48:01 AM PDT
Doesn't the White House have a number or email? Why can't we as citizens take this to the front door. Let them know we are outraged?
by redtex on Thu May 15, 2008 at 12:16:13 PM PDT
...have shown for the American people, the U.S. Constitution, and fundamental principles of humanity, fairness, and the rule of law, it didn't even occur to me that anyone in the Bush administration would actually listen to a constituent.
by SciVo on Thu May 15, 2008 at 05:02:54 PM PDT
wide narrow
View Story | 308 comments