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View Diary: PNAC Co-Founder Endorses Dems in '08 (221 comments)

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  •  I have no doubt as to the PNAC's motives (6+ / 0-)

    but to assume that because the PNAC wants to use the Dems or the DLCers in particular does not mean that the DLC wants to be used by them. And that's what I was left with from your diary.  

    Kagans' philosophy has to do with the ultimate right to dominate the world. The DLC does not promote that worldview. They are much more progressive (gasp!) than that, although, as I said, clearly much less progressive than the tastes of most Kossacks. They are willing to use military force. That is what they have in common, and that is obviously where most of us differ with them. That is not the same thing as saying it's the same phenomenon.

    •  Corpocracy is what its about (18+ / 0-)

      The DLC and the PNAC are both about corporate control of our foreign policy, along with the rest of our government, not for ideological reasons but because that's where the money is.

      It used to be said that the Democrats care about people and the Republicans care about money.  The difference is harder to define, these days.

      Reality has a well-known liberal bias. --Colbert

      by MadScientist on Sun May 28, 2006 at 06:58:08 PM PDT

      [ Parent ]

      •  campaign financing (3+ / 0-)
        Recommended by:
        oceanspray, Gegner, bdmac

        The campaign financing structure has a lot to do with this. GE, Boeing, etc., have tons of money to distribute to those who support their aim to achieve higher profits.

      •  Why not just say this: (3+ / 0-)
        Recommended by:
        bluewolverine, ChemBob, bdmac

        PNAC (and I suspect AIPAC, too, same neocons) are just rational expressions and projections of the M/I Complex and their Corporate interactors. There's probably more, with back-ups, if you're really curious.

        Seems like we need to open a study on Human Predation. If we want those things mentioned in the Constitution and The Bill of Rights, we must declare war on those human predators, or, if we're ever so damn clever, eliminate them by whatever means is most effective in lieu of warring.

    •  On military force- (4+ / 0-)

      I think the majority of folks on this site are okay with using military force where we are really attacked but are against using it to simply "dominate the world".

      Maybe that's what you said, but I just wanted to express my opinion formed from the time I've spent here.

      -- What really makes America, America?

      by mike101 on Sun May 28, 2006 at 08:09:58 PM PDT

      [ Parent ]

      •  Agree 100% (3+ / 0-)
        Recommended by:
        bluewolverine, ChemBob, Wary

        But the neocons seem to be so arrogant that they really BELIEVE that we should make the rest of the world like us!  UGH... that is so arrogant.  Why don't we BE AMERICA, GROW AMERICA, TAKE CARE OF AMERI-cans and let the world take care of all of the little dictators?  If we would get out of the way I think the global problems would resolve themselves.  

        •  Maybe they aren't arrogant (0+ / 0-)

          Maybe they're well directed, well financed and well armed and making the world into their image is their prime directive.

          Cheers

          •  If that is their prime directive, ... (0+ / 0-)

            I wonder how they justify it to themselves- as a personal power trip; that the world would really be a better place to live; or, are they just that much into doing what they're told to do by those holding some sort of power.

            Maybe it's just a loose coalition of the ignorant and/or frightened dupes. If that's what it is, we really have to grab a megaphone.

            -- What really makes America, America?

            by mike101 on Mon May 29, 2006 at 02:40:11 PM PDT

            [ Parent ]

            •  The Belligerants (1+ / 0-)
              Recommended by:
              mike101

              Whether they justify it or not is dependent on whether they have a conscience.

              I would suspect their power trip is contained within a larger power game, whether PNAC, incredibly old, rich families, corporations, pick 'em...

              I would think the upper echelon is a tight hierarchial group, but breaks into several segments going downward and that the coaliton gets looser the farther down you go. Fear and ignorance certainly have some role. This group retaliates. Also note that ignorance in this case is not necessarily lack of education, but a certain lack of questioning, perhaps of sympathetic obedience or coercive control. Power and money seem to play such a role with the neocons, perhaps more than a few saw money as an inducement, a political gravy train hard to quit once it is rolling.

              And, yeah, the world might be a little better if we cease being the Belligerants. We're making some big waves.

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