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View Diary: Two-term incumbent repeatedly smears unpaid staffer (me) (185 comments)

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  •  The difference is... (28+ / 0-)

    Libel is written, or expressed in film or other media.  Slander is anything that is spoken, not published.  Both fall under "defamation."

    There needs to be a statement made by Klein that is false, but stated as fact.  It would seem that his statement about you wanting to make an anonymous donation to his campaign would be a statement that was presented as fact.  A defamation suit would be pretty easy to put forth, I would think.  It is a lie.  Leaving your name and information proves that the contribution was never taken to be anonymous.  

    Sue the jerk.  And write letters to the editor.  I'll go contribute what I can.  But sue.. and then use some of that to get Rowley elected.  I'm so sick of politics like this.

    •  Defamation (8+ / 0-)

      Associated Press Stylebook and Libel Manual:

      (Katapodis vs. Brooklyn Spectator Inc., 28 7 N.Y. 17) libel the matter is defamatory not only if it brings a party into hatred, ridicule or contempt by asserting some moral discredit upon his part, but also if it tends to make him be shunned or avoided...

      Bizarro World sucks... I want to go home to America.

      Dial Acorn Heads for all your website needs!

      by willers on Thu Aug 17, 2006 at 10:16:33 AM PDT

      [ Parent ]

    •  The question, though, (2+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      SarahLee, Elise

      is whether or not Bailey received anything from Klein's campaign in the mail that would prove that he did, in fact, leave his name, address, etc. and didn't try to anonymously make the donation.

      •  USA Today: Kline staff admit Bailey gave his name (27+ / 0-)

        No question: Bailey gave his real name, address, and e-mail, reports USA Today:

        Bailey gave his real e-mail address and his real address, which was subsequently used to learn his connection to the Rowley campaign, Kline spokesman Marcus Esmay said.

        Rowley's campaign manager, Rogers, said, "It doesn't sound like a very secretive operation when you leave your e-mail and address."

        That seems to be an admission by Kline's spokesman against his and Kline's own interests, and therefore is very credible evidence for a defamation lawsuit against Kline and his campaign staff, in my opinion as a layperson. I urge Bailey to seek advice on filing a defamation lawsuit from a qualified attorney who regularly handles First Amendment law.

        •  As a lawyer (1+ / 0-)
          Recommended by:

          I would advise Bailey not to bother any attorneys with this garbage, and to quit "helping" congressional candidates.  

          Tämä Mia Dolan on ihan hirveä (That Mia Dolan is just awful or This Mia Dolan is made of Moose )

          by Mia Dolan on Thu Aug 17, 2006 at 01:35:07 PM PDT

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          •  Are you trolling? n/t (1+ / 0-)
            Recommended by:
            Catte Nappe
            •  Trolling? (1+ / 0-)
              Recommended by:

              I am attempting to point out that the people here talking about defamation claims don't know what  they are talking about.  What Kline says is a slight exaggeration at best -- it is essentially true.  And its not actionable.  If this guy sued,he would end up paying John Kline money.  Although the diarist is not a public figure, he is working for a public figure and the allegations relate to his work on Rowley's behalf.  This is political speech, and as such, the most first amendment protection is afforded to it, making it is very difficult to prove up a defamation claim.  

              If a staffer for a Republican congressional candidate had his own political website with controvertial positions, people on DailyKos would be all over it.  The diarist screwed up bigtime, and writing a diary about it is even more of a disservice to Rowley.  If he really wanted to help her out, he would delete this diary and shut up.

              Tämä Mia Dolan on ihan hirveä (That Mia Dolan is just awful or This Mia Dolan is made of Moose )

              by Mia Dolan on Thu Aug 17, 2006 at 03:20:01 PM PDT

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              •  Really? (0+ / 0-)

                What Kline says is a slight exaggeration at best -- it is essentially true.

                What is essentially true?  
                1)The diarist didn't work for Rowley when he went to Kline's office.
                2)He didn't try to give money anonymously.
                3)What's phony about a $10 bill?
                4)He didn't try to hide his identity.
                5)Is he a "senior member of Coleen Rowley's campaign"?  
                6)Is he Coleen Rowley's research director?  

                I count six outright lies in four sentences.
                I'm no lawyer and I wouldn't give legal advice one way or the other but for you to say that flyer was essentially true is ridiculous.

                It's a sad day in America when politicians think unpaid volunteers are fair game for public smear campaigns.

                •  It is a sad day (2+ / 0-)
                  Recommended by:
                  Rupert, texaspixie

                  but its not actionable.

                  Tämä Mia Dolan on ihan hirveä (That Mia Dolan is just awful or This Mia Dolan is made of Moose )

                  by Mia Dolan on Thu Aug 17, 2006 at 04:35:05 PM PDT

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                  •  It's a sad day (1+ / 0-)
                    Recommended by:
                    Mia Dolan

                    When you, Mia, give expert advice and get accused of being a troll because of it!

                    •  What frustrates me (0+ / 0-)

                      is the reaction to this.  Republicans are dirty cheaters?  Tell me something I don't know. Four years ago, Minnesota Republicans spun Paul Wellstone's funeral into electoral victory.  They are going to keep doing it, especially if we keep making it easy for them.  

                      Instead of talking about suing them or exposing Kline for this we should work on not giving the Republicans easy material to work with.  Maybe some self-reflection instead of cheerleading.  Despite all the bitching here, if you read the linked article about this with any objectivity, its Rowley who looks bad.  Time to stop pretending everything is ok when its not.

                      Rowley needs to:

                      1. issue a statement explaining that this guy was not with the campaign when he went to Kline's office, and that the content on the website was not authorized by the campaign.
                      1. Shitcan him.

                      Tämä Mia Dolan on ihan hirveä (That Mia Dolan is just awful or This Mia Dolan is made of Moose )

                      by Mia Dolan on Thu Aug 17, 2006 at 10:18:10 PM PDT

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              •  Closer calls (1+ / 0-)
                Recommended by:
                Mia Dolan
                The "public figure" test could go either way, tho more likely Mia's correct.

                1st Amendment center
                Actual malice -- In New York Times Co. v. Sullivan (1964), the Supreme Court defined actual malice as a state of mind in which a person or publication makes an untrue and defamatory statement about a person "with knowledge that it was false or with reckless disregard of whether it was false or not." In order to recover damages for libel or defamation, a public official or public figure must be able to show by clear and convincing evidence that the defendant acted with actual malice.

                "and once he accused me of promoting meth." does not follow from the quoted exerpt, in which he only claimed you'd promoted decriminalizing it, not its use.

                Presuming Klein was not present for your visit, he can argue that his release was based on the impression he'd received on retelling by the staffers who were present. Mssing the nuance of the 2 offices would thus not show actual malice.

                $1 donations only.
                Masel 4 Senate
                1214 E. Mifflin
                Madison, WI 53703

                by ben masel on Thu Aug 17, 2006 at 08:06:57 PM PDT

                [ Parent ]

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