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View Diary: VA-Sen: Allen's Confederate Flag "collection" (187 comments)

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  •  Haha (0+ / 0-)

    I basically wrote a post that copies yours before I read yours. The only thing I would note is that seatbeltless drivers actually get in less acidents than those with seatbelts. This was found when people used to have the ability to buy a car without seatbelts so it might not hold up anymore, but I haven't seen newer data.

    "Quidquid dicendum est, libere dicam." -Cicero

    by BennyAbelard on Fri Aug 25, 2006 at 07:27:35 PM PDT

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    •  Doesn't sound right (1+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      BennyAbelard

      especially people who don't wear seatbelts are by definition less responsible, and also aggressive (just look at how they argue about it) and bigger risk takers, from everything I've read.

      To sum up, a secondary reason for seatbelts is to help you keep control of your vehicle so you don't endanger others. Libertarians and conservatives don't care about others, so this makes no sense to them. Why they don't want the other guy to keep control of his vehicle so they don't get hit is beyond me - just another predictable inconsistency. <sigh>

      "Question authority and the authorities will question you." Now more than ever!

      by armadillo on Fri Aug 25, 2006 at 07:40:12 PM PDT

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      •  Well (0+ / 0-)

        there are studies that show this. Steven Landsberg talked about it in the mass market book The Armchair Economist. Granted Landsberg is crazy even for an economist, but the numbers are there.

        The theory basically goes like this: a seatbelt's main function is to reduce injury when an accident occurs. By doing this it decreases the cost of accidents. Since accidents no longer cost as much, people take fewer precautions to prevent them and therefore get into more accidents.

        The net result seen in studies was that, with seatbelts, a lower percentage of accidents resulted in fatalities. At the same time the number of accidents increased to a degree such that the total number of fatalities stayed the same.

        That being said, I don't know whether anyone has examined the case of seatbelts allowing you to maintain control over your vehicle in the case of an accident. Would be interesting to see.

        Also, the studies I am aware of were done before the universal inclusion of seatbelts in cars. So I tend to think that you are right to suggest that today, when the cost of using a seatbelt is only 5 seconds when you enter the car, only the inherently reckless will not use seatbelts. That could cause the earlier positive correlation between accidents and seatbelts to dissapear.

        "Quidquid dicendum est, libere dicam." -Cicero

        by BennyAbelard on Fri Aug 25, 2006 at 09:09:57 PM PDT

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        •  Losing control of vehicle (0+ / 0-)

          That being said, I don't know whether anyone has examined the case of seatbelts allowing you to maintain control over your vehicle in the case of an accident. Would be interesting to see.

          Kind of self-evident, no? Si?

          The most recent example I saw was a news story on employers placing cameras in company vehicles to prove or disprove carelessness. In one, a guy hits something or gets hit. He goes from the driver's seat to the back glass and back to the front. My guess he couldn't control the vehicle while in the back seat, but that's just me. Once things settled down, I doubt he'd be healthy enough to get control again.

          I got T-boned once and while I had a bad bruise on my left arm, I never let go of the wheel. I saw it coming and hit the brakes. My foot stayed on the brake through the whole thing - I was stopped before I even got all the way through the intersection. Had I not been belted, no way I could have kept control. Moral: There is no argument against firsthand experience. :)

          Likewise, I T-boned a Chevette that ran a stop sign in a 1972 T-bird, not an even match. The occupants bounced around the car like pingpong balls.

          Surely you've seen those insurance industry crash test films, too. Pretty obvious. Let's hope the conservatives and liberatians feel some personal responsibility for the safety of others, if not themselves, and buckle up. Not likely with authoritarians, though.

          I'll take my chances with the self-evident.

          Sorry for contributing to the hijacking of this diary.

          "Question authority and the authorities will question you." Now more than ever!

          by armadillo on Sat Aug 26, 2006 at 01:07:42 PM PDT

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