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View Diary: RE: TEACHERS COLLEGES SUCK (44 comments)

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  •  The Report Was Mostly Right (2+ / 0-)
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    Rick Oliver, Pumpkinlove

    I didn't read the article you referred to, but the report got a lot of things right.

    It said that teacher training should be viewed as a profession. I got my Masters in Teaching while my wife was a Medical Resident, and I wish teacher training was more like medical training. While I was reading Freud and Plato, my wife was learning how to treat patients. I am not saying that nobody should read Freud or Plato, but teacher training does have to focus more on what good teachers do and less on the pet theories of the month or overreaching philosophical issues.

    You are correct about the elitism in the report. Ideally, we could increase the amount of teacher training by elite universities without harming the good programs that exist at local colleges. The report should have made clearer that our country cannot afford to ignore the training at local colleges.

    Liars and Bribers and Whores--Oh My!

    by Reino on Thu Sep 21, 2006 at 09:48:06 AM PDT

    •  i'm not sure... (1+ / 0-)
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      ...what colleges they're looking at, but my dad went through his education degree while i was in middle school (1991-94), and he had classes on how to teach math, how to teach science, how to teach english, etc.  they were practical, down-to-earth courses that gave him lots of strategies.  his master's program was even better.  i know plenty of people with teaching degrees who got what they needed to instruct kids.

      now, that's not controlling for the fact that students show up to school starving, beaten up, lacking sleep, and/or fearing for their lives by leaving the house.  those problems require way more than just a supportive teacher (although god knows that makes a huge difference!).

      all i'm saying is, this report seems a bit... superficial.  the question in my mind is, how can educators improve the way kids learn, and how can society support teachers in what they do?  that's the big one.

      it's a round world, last time i checked. - bill hicks (-8.00, -7.18)

      by liberalsouth on Thu Sep 21, 2006 at 09:53:27 AM PDT

      [ Parent ]

      •  yes yes yes (2+ / 0-)
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        liberalsouth, COTeach

        there are amazing programs out there, but they can't be identified because of a larger project: centralizing control of who gets taught what and how...

      •  You're Right (1+ / 0-)
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        The report is simplistic. There are some good teacher training programs out there in addition to a lot of bad ones.

        Keep in mind, however, that the report was not trying to answer your question. It was focused on teacher training, which is a subset of the problem of societal support of teachers and schools. Even though it is not as big as the problem you are thinking of, it is a serious issue.

        Liars and Bribers and Whores--Oh My!

        by Reino on Thu Sep 21, 2006 at 10:27:00 AM PDT

        [ Parent ]

    •  Are you saying you didn't do student teaching? (0+ / 0-)

      The local teacher training colleges here have a pretty strong student teaching and mentoring system.

      •  I did student teach (1+ / 0-)
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        Actually, I taught in private schools for three years before getting certified.

        Part of my certification involved a methods course and student teaching. That was the good part. I took about 15 other courses at $1300 per that wasted my time and money. Because I had been in the classroom, it was obvious to me that they were wasting my time. Some of the courses were in Education, some were in Math (since I was training to become a high school math teacher), and others were part of the general distribution requirements for state certification.

        The education courses included philosophy, adult education, research, and a bunch of other things I have blocked out of my mind. (It's been over ten years.)

        Liars and Bribers and Whores--Oh My!

        by Reino on Thu Sep 21, 2006 at 10:48:30 AM PDT

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        •  Ah ha.. (0+ / 0-)

          You did the cart before the horse...*no wonder*  teacher training seemed like such a waste of your time!

          •  Yes But (0+ / 0-)

            What disappointed me the most was to watch over 100 teachers-to-be wasting their time when there was a lot for them to learn. As a young teacher, I could have benefitted from readings and discussions directly tied to classroom practices. There were not enough such readings or discussions.

            Liars and Bribers and Whores--Oh My!

            by Reino on Fri Sep 22, 2006 at 05:31:16 AM PDT

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        •  you put philosophy (1+ / 0-)
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          out of your mind?

          you are part of the problem.

          •  No (0+ / 0-)

            I was thinking more along the lines of classroom management. As a professor of education, I am sure that you are aware that classroom management is one of the most, if not the most difficult, job responsilibities to master. It is also, IMHO, the most likely cause of about half of new teachers quitting the profession after a year or two.

          •  First Of All (0+ / 0-)

            Fuck You

            Second of all, you don't know me. I am knowledgeable in a lot of areas, including philosophy, but teacher training should be about teacher training. I entered the program after getting my AB from Brown University.

            Third of all, aside from at most a single ethics course somewhere in the course of 4 years, we don't expect students in Medical School to study the works of Plato or Rousseau. Teacher training should be about preparing teachers for the classroom, not studying the history of philosophy.

            Liars and Bribers and Whores--Oh My!

            by Reino on Fri Sep 22, 2006 at 04:16:29 AM PDT

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            •  your language (1+ / 0-)
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              betrays a certain self consciousness and fear...

              As a teacher teacher, and someone with over a decade of classroom experience, I find it problematic that so many teachers don't even know why they are there or why we have something called public education in the first place.

              In fact, one might argue, simply for non-philosophers, that public education as is, peopled with individuals who don't think about what they are doing, is a greater hinderance to democracy, as defined by Dewey, than neoconservatives could ever hope to be.

              That might even explain why neoconservatives support public "education."

              Perhaps when we meet at yearly kos we can talk...i'm looking forward to you looking me in the eye and repeating your comment.

              •  Sorry (0+ / 0-)

                I'm too busy teaching, raising young children, and caring for a sick wife to attend Yearlykos, but I hope you enjoy it. We both work hard in the hopes that young people will learn to ask questions and think, so I realize that we do have a lot in common.

                I'm glad you are doing what you are doing, but to say that I am part of the problem because I was bored reading Plato and Rousseau when I should have been learning how to teach is going a bit far, no? Are you proposing that teachers who don't fully appreciate Emile should be kicked out of our nation's classrooms? Furthermore, should teachers who question teacher training programs be classified as too unappreciative of the status quo to be allowed in the classroom? I know you didn't mean those things, but calling me part of the problem based on my short post above doesn't shine a great light on you.

                Liars and Bribers and Whores--Oh My!

                by Reino on Fri Sep 22, 2006 at 08:45:28 AM PDT

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                •  i hate emile (2+ / 0-)
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                  Reino, elie

                  maybe your philosophy class just sucked.

                  and you are correct, i do need to work on the light i shine on myself and others...i'm letting frustration and stress trump common sense.

                  i am sitting here wishing only the best for you...

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