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View Diary: Iraq accountability: November and March (157 comments)

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  •  Exciting News! Drier says SEPTEMBER 2007! (3+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    kid oakland, kingubu, Geekesque

    I'll take September 2007!

    Just on Hardball - David Drier says they need "a chance" until September 2007!

    Let's push that date and quote Drier!!

    •  Trojan Horse? (4+ / 0-)

      Seriously, you and I both know what's going to happen if Dems give Bush the war funding with no strings: every GOP operative will stand in front of their mirrors practicing a line that says, roughly, "Democrats voted to fund the war, why are they complaining now?"

      Drier is just another Arlen Spector, sent out to give the impression that maybe someday the Republicans will change their minds but only if the Dems cave in the short term. We should know by now that the "maybe someday" never actually happens and not get sucked in.

      Those who begin coercive elimination of dissent soon find themselves exterminating dissenters. --Justice Robert H. Jackson

      by kingubu on Tue May 01, 2007 at 04:24:51 PM PDT

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      •  No, the Republicans don't want to be standing (2+ / 0-)
        Recommended by:
        kingubu, elie

        in front of the camera.

        Everyone knows who's for leaving and who's for staying.

      •  I am just responding to the "pick a date" (2+ / 0-)
        Recommended by:
        kid oakland, kingubu

        concept and Drier picked an earlier date than the two in the diary.

        •  Gotcha (1+ / 0-)
          Recommended by:
          inclusiveheart

          I'm just a little testy, I guess. I'm unspeakably sick of watching Dems get duped by these transparent third-rate hucksters.

          Those who begin coercive elimination of dissent soon find themselves exterminating dissenters. --Justice Robert H. Jackson

          by kingubu on Tue May 01, 2007 at 04:31:50 PM PDT

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          •  Do you think they've been duped? (1+ / 0-)
            Recommended by:
            kid oakland

            You may be right, but give it a day or two to see how this fleshes out.  I didn't get the sense from Pelosi's response to the President's statement that she is either duped or defeated.  Let's see what happens.

            •  No (4+ / 0-)

              Some examples of the kind of 'duped' I mean:

              Bush wants to invade Iraq but he knows he can't just say that. So, he sends "moderates" on the Hill onto the floor and on the TV to talk about creating a bill authorizing military force as a means to strengthen his position in UN negotiations (which sounds perfectly reasonable). Dems go along and sign the AUMF based on that historic "don't make me take my belt off" diplomatic tactic. Once passed, Bush invades Iraq and paints every Dem who voted for the AUMF as "voting to go to war". Duped.

              Bush wants to direct more funds to charter schools and de-fund public schools but he knows that he can't just say that. So he feigns moderation by co-opting Kennedy to craft a bill that put pressure on public schools via standardized testing, but, we're told, that's okay because along with those benchmarks will come billions more in education funding. Kennedy signs on, the bill passes. The benchmarks that clobber public schools get implemented immediately, but magically the funding gets slow-walked or never appears at all. Duped.

              My point is that Hill Dems have been foooled over and over because they want so badly to hear something sensible from the GOP that, when they are given the appearance of such sensibility from the "moderate" GOP members, they fall for it.

              I get your point about pointing to Drier's comments to say "see? even GOP members support more aggressive deadlines". but the fact is that such moderate-sounding rhetoric is just a way to say "just give the president what he wants and we'll talk later" and we should know by now that later never comes.

              Those who begin coercive elimination of dissent soon find themselves exterminating dissenters. --Justice Robert H. Jackson

              by kingubu on Tue May 01, 2007 at 05:02:07 PM PDT

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              •  Well, I totally agree with you in your assessment (1+ / 0-)
                Recommended by:
                kid oakland

                I'm thinking fairly politically at this point because Bush has taken this to a purely political position having nothing to do with the war or the state of our military.  So, the next step is going to be getting the pressure on the Republicans in Congress heated up to an unbearable level which is sort of what I thik KO is suggesting on a certain level.  The reality is that with the number of people we have in Iraq right now, the real redeployment will take until about September.  Now Olbermann is citing September as a GOP deadline.  Now you may be right that it is a ploy, but maybe we can force them to put their money where their mouth is and make them vote for a bill that sets that month as a hard deadline with no wiggle room.  Am I pie in the sky?  Probably, but a girl has to dream about hope and possibility every once in a while.  In any case, the President has rejected the will of the large majority of the people tonight and condemned more men and women in our military to death and one hopeful moment I witnessed is that that grim fact was not lost on our leadership tonight - that is why I want to give them a chance before I get depressed again.  xox :)

        •  I am completely open to an earlier date (2+ / 0-)
          Recommended by:
          conchita, inclusiveheart

          or the two month short leash.

          November/March should be the minimum, imo.  I would like to see them set with power of the purse.

          k/o: politics and culture

          by kid oakland on Tue May 01, 2007 at 04:52:21 PM PDT

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