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View Diary: Sanchez Approved Torture; White House May Be Linked to Decision (169 comments)

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  •  Your Point is Logically Sound (4.00)
    I think, though, that it was the administration that essentially argued that Gitmo was the exception, and the brass has been arguing all along that what happened at Abu Ghraib could not be construed as an extension of policy directives from any higher up than the handful of non-coms and maybe an officer or two at Abu Ghraib.  The Sanchez memos show that to be complete rubish.  

    Also, while the outrage is understandably more focused on the sexual humiliation, the tactics initially approved by Sanchez, immediately after Miller's visit in September, include plenty of other offenses not as easily captured in a snapshot but nonetheless completely beyond the bounds of acceptable methods of interrogation or conditions for incarceration, such as withholding prisoners' religious paraphenalia, exposing them to extreme heat, and denying them a diet that wouldn't prevent weight loss and nutritional deficiencies.  Again, these methods are dubious at best when used on the population housed at Gitmo, but they are beyond any standard measures used in "normal" military prisons.  The military knows that, which is why these memos showing that Sanchez approved measures he later denyed condolning could very well, in regards to not just the brass but also the civillian leadership, "break this issue wide open."

    •  Not only did the "administration" (none)
      insist that Gitmo (and Afghanistan?) was the exception.  Or, rather, that Iraq was the exception: there the GCs applied.  Of course, they applied there, because it was only a "few bad apples" who did the torture, and (politically) we are for the rule of law, so we're gonna try their asses off and give 'em a year in jail.

      They also crossed themselves in another way: they asserted to the world and the SC that Gitmo is outside US jurisdiction, therefore outside US obligations under GC, treaties, and Federal War Crimes Act.  

      But in the memo/es they asserted that those who did torture in Gitmo were also exempt from the rule of law because Gitmo is under American jurisdiction and rule of law.

      "Oh what a tangled web" they've woven.  Parts of it look like hangman's nooses.

      A lie is halfway around the world before the truth can get its shoes on. -- Mark Twain

      by jnagarya on Mon Jun 14, 2004 at 12:52:49 AM PDT

      [ Parent ]

      •  Funny thing about Gitmo. (none)
        But isn't Gitmo and american military base, and therefore entirely within the wider american jurisdiction. Cuban law does not operate within its walls and wire fences. If fact, the American military state that they were given an "indefinite" lease by the legal goverment of the Cuba (which was a protectorate of the U.S. at the time and like Iraq today, had no real soveriengty!) and since U.S. does not reconize the Castro's goverment authority over Gitmo, then whose laws/jurisdiction applies there?

        "It is not for honour nor riches, nor glory that we fight but for liberty alone, which no true man lays down except with his life." Declaration of Arbroath, 13

        by Ralfast on Mon Jun 14, 2004 at 07:46:39 AM PDT

        [ Parent ]

        •  It's under US jurisdiction, (none)
          therefore it's under US law -- exactly as admitted in the memo/es as means to protect torturers in Gitmo who are operating under US law.

          The claim to the SC is the opposite -- and part of the more extreme position: the a president is beyond the constraints of the Constitution.

          Even though, of course <wink, wink, nudge, nudge> the administration doesn't use torture.

          Which we learned several hours later was a lie.
           

          A lie is halfway around the world before the truth can get its shoes on. -- Mark Twain

          by jnagarya on Mon Jun 14, 2004 at 05:41:25 PM PDT

          [ Parent ]

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