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View Diary: Updated-USAGate: Big analysis by Kos Volunteers (221 comments)

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  •  Hmmm.... I presumed (I know, bad to do it) (0+ / 0-)

    that you folks were already forming a group to approach the Judiciary Committees.  I will have consider what if anything I can do to help you folks with some of my skills.

    Thank you for your supporting statement.  We live in unusual times and we now have a governing body that would not know "rule of law" if it whacked them up side the head.  It is so strange that guy who signs bills into law and his organs of enforcement don't have to follow the same.  

    Good thing I never give up.

    BushCo Policy... If you aren't outraged, you haven't been paying attention. -3.25 -2.26

    by Habanero on Mon May 14, 2007 at 04:12:38 AM PDT

    [ Parent ]

    •  great attitude! (0+ / 0-)

      and yes, it's hard to recognize this country.

      Since I am not on this project (I'm working on another one), I can just ask that maybe you email drational (drational AT yahoo ). I will also email him and suggest he read through our sub-thread.

      Best regards,
      rhfactor

      •  Their company has responded and I hope to (0+ / 0-)

        either buy a time limited version of the application which is discounted, or the full version if available at a fair cost for a noble purpose?  

        My time and dollars are availabe only if Leahy or Conyers can provide all of the unredated data.  

        FYI - Regarding the internet portion of the wiretap program Comey won't name...  it is "Sentinel."  

        http://www.dailykos.com/...

        Remember you heard it here first; I caught the bastards and I know how they do it and at least six locations where they do it.

        BushCo Policy... If you aren't outraged, you haven't been paying attention. -3.25 -2.26

        by Habanero on Tue May 15, 2007 at 02:08:28 PM PDT

        [ Parent ]

        •  I read that Comey thread today (0+ / 0-)

          Let me just ask -- so that I do not "assume" and make ass of myself :)

          These committee members must know the name Sentinel and some of its operational characteristics, no? ?

          Or does this fall into the category of "they are so far behind the tech curve that they wouldn't even know the name of Carnivore and Escehlon" (I only know those programs by name, I don't know who uses them and for what -- but I believe one is an FBI operation, and the other is an NSA operation.)

          QUESTION:

          I'm assuming in this case that you've very long ago given up the idea that communications like this public one are not being looked at or tracked, correct?

          My assumption is that they ARE tracked, but I'm not a tech/engineer so I wouldn't know. I just know that from the whole ATT employee whisteblower case and the NSA room in a San Francisco ATT hub, as revealed in that WIRED magazine article when it came out (has it been 2 years?), the engineer who discovered the splitting off of the trunk lines was saying that they, in effect, were capable of monitoring every single phone call and internet transmission, period.

          It's interesting to me that America has seemed just fine & dandy with idea that every single phone call of every  person in the Unites States has been logged, if not recorded in some media format... And that Verizon and ATT gladly handed over the keys to their customers' data.

          Anyway, my question is this: Given the likelihood that this could be read by one or more of those surveillance systems as soon as I hit "publish", through sophisticated keyword and IP monitoring, have you more or less chosen to communicate everything you say about these issues publicly, in forums like this, under the premise that there IS NO secure method you could otherwise communicate these items, so may as well just post publicly... ?

          Hmm, I guess the reason you have not emailed drational is that you don't feel comfortable using email?

          •  At the risk of assuming myself..... (0+ / 0-)

            I am sure that at least the select committee on intelligence and the judiciary committee would have been read in, but how could I know?  I am pretty sure they could never say if they knew.

            What I found out occurred because my system was being probed regularly and in detectable ways.  I then conducted my own experiments downloading certain web content, visiting certain sites, and using certain MS character sets to see what triggers these activities and what does not seem to. Their system probed my network and I probed back not originally knowing who it was.  

            The most important fact is that EVERYTHING I had tested with was FIRST AMENDMENT PROTECTED MATERIALS.

            "Given the likelihood that this could be read by one or more of those surveillance systems as soon as I hit "publish", through sophisticated keyword and IP monitoring, have you more or less chosen to communicate everything you say about these issues publicly, in forums like this, under the premise that there IS NO secure method you could otherwise communicate these items, so may as well just post publicly... ?"

            DING!

            Not only likely, it is happening when I am on DailyKos.

            BushCo Policy... If you aren't outraged, you haven't been paying attention. -3.25 -2.26

            by Habanero on Wed May 16, 2007 at 07:33:50 AM PDT

            [ Parent ]

            •  I'm not clear -- what were the triggers? (0+ / 0-)

              or I mean trigger factors that you concluded were part of the listening algorithms?

              for example, DID the character sets make a difference?

              Did the type of sites make a difference, and so on.

              Also, am I to assume that you use one or more anonymizers or proxies so as not to so readily release your IP, or have you also given up on protecting your IP -- since their systems can penetrate anonymizers & proxies & extract the source IP?

              If they have your IPs, then is any of the research useful, since the global variable would be:

              if <IP address> in use, track and record all activity.

              I understand the basic logic of software, but as I said, anything more technical than the above and i will glaze my eyes over without comprehending.

              ALso, just to get your take on this:

              IF:

              Everything you do on dkos is watched/tracked/perhaps recorded, then which is the most likely scenario:

              (1) as a matter of fact, EVERYONE who posts at DK is being monitored with high scrutiny ...

              or
              (2) I know for sure, or pretty darn sure, that anyone who engages me (you) online here is being tracked as well.

              (3) It varies. It's resource intensive so sometimes there may be a randomizer involved so as to cut down on low-liklihood traitor-hood ?

              I just invented that word:  traitor-hood ... The state of being in defiance of the GOP and its party control over the US Government by raising flags at any and all exmaples of first-amendment abridgment by GOP and its federal agents, and making public the criminal acts of the bush administration.

              Is that a successful definition of traitorhood?

              And finally --- in all seriousness -- I cannot believe that a high percentage of FBI/NSA/other surveillance agency employess agree to work on these clearly anti-American programs beung run by these agencies in open defiance of Congress and the U.S. Constitution.

              So, (a) how do these employees who DO perform these illegal monitoring activities, such as reading this right now, square that with their oaths of office or oaths to protect & defend the US Constitution?

              (b) DO they simply set their brain's constitutional filtration tolerance to zero and thus not factor it into anything they do at all.  

              (c) Or do you believe some of them simply believe in doing anything they are told to do by a superior to whom they report -- legalities of such orders being non-operative considerations?

              (d) do you think, for one moment, for one nano-second, that any of the people on the job right now monitoring via use of sentinel, carnivore, eschelon and Cheneyon, actually believe they are in fact protecting America and our way of life -- in the very performance of their surveillance using these illegal methods?

              (e) are there any, do you think, who lay awake at night and wonder how they've gotten to this place where the thing they worked so hard to be good at was now being used to tear down America vs protect & defend it?

              •  FYI I am no expert, I know a bit and they (0+ / 0-)

                make lots of mistakes.

                "for example, DID the character sets make a difference?"

                Hebrew and Arabic did.

                "Did the type of sites make a difference, and so on."

                Yes, sites with dissenting speech such as DailyKos, foreign news websites in the UK, Germany as did using the search engine fireball.de, certain distasteful websites in Brazil, etc... downloading a copy of the Koran, sending email(s) to relatives expressing serious dislike of BushCo policies, but never threats.

                "Also, am I to assume that you use one or more anonymizers or proxies so as not to so readily release your IP, or have you also given up on protecting your IP."

                No anonymizer for me, however they mask their IPs, and no I have zero inclination to let the cat out of the bag how it is detectable.  I will worry when I can no longer figure out how they do that.  Why should I anonymize, I would tell George Bush to go straight to hell right to his face, why cover it up.  

                "(3) It varies" This option.

                "And finally --- in all seriousness -- I cannot believe that a high percentage of FBI/NSA/other surveillance agency employess agree to work on these clearly anti-American programs beung run by these agencies in open defiance of Congress and the U.S. Constitution."

                Blind faith in a corrupt institution.  Regarding the companies who helped it was $$$$$$

                Google Comversys, Infosys, and Verint.  

                Multimillion dollar contract right after September 11th.  Remember when John Ashcroft said we want people to talk and Ari Flesher (spelling) said "people need to watch what they say?

                Keyword(s) and connection(s) are the backbone of how this occurs.  When a target of interest is located it takes very little to have your browser give much info including your email address.

                Also read up on "webcrawlers."  The FBI love those.

                To your final question I would reply that those whose work fly in the face of thier oath to uphold the Constitution, they should restrict their activities to ONLY catching terrorists because that threat is real.  Any other data obtained should be declared fruit of the poison tree.

                BushCo Policy... If you aren't outraged, you haven't been paying attention. -3.25 -2.26

                by Habanero on Wed May 16, 2007 at 05:15:44 PM PDT

                [ Parent ]

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