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View Diary: Edwards: "My Faith Came Roaring Back" - CNN Faith/Politics Forum (315 comments)

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  •  I'd prefer (13+ / 0-)

    someone who uses his brains, not his prayers, when making political decisions.

    Silly me.

    Whackos get their info thru the Christian right. We'll bring them out to vote against something and make sure the public lets the whole thing slip past them.

    by chemsmith on Mon Jun 04, 2007 at 07:35:46 PM PDT

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    •  silly me (4+ / 0-)

      I expect people to actually read the transcript.

    •  Some would say (18+ / 0-)

      It was silly not to use everything at your disposal to inform difficult choices.

      Hillary actually said it very well:

      But, if I had not been a praying person, shortly after coming to the White House, I would have become one in a big hurry.

      And note, I am at best agnostic.  But being a tolerant  liberal, I respect, and often admire those who articulate policies compatable with both their faith and the betterment of all of us.

      If praying reinforces that moral compass, may the Flying Spaghetti Monster bless you.

      Be excellent to each other.-Bill and Ted
      Dispassionate Liberal

      by Mark Adams on Mon Jun 04, 2007 at 07:47:41 PM PDT

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    •  I, too. While I fully respect (11+ / 0-)

      peoples individual affirmations of faith, I find it uncomfortable to listen to the proclaimations the more recent campaigners feel moved to make.

      I was taught about the Pharisees, too, (as Richardson mentioned tonight) and remember well the lesson that one's actions speak louder than their words. The now commonplace vision of public prayer over meals in restaurants and other blatant religious rituals belong in church, IMHO.

      The actions of kindness, generosity, humility, compassion, fairness, and honesty make a much greater impression on me, and do more to further one's particular religious beliefs.

      "In the United States, political will is a renewable resource". Gore 2008

      by Lisa Lockwood on Mon Jun 04, 2007 at 07:51:31 PM PDT

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      •  Are you uncomfortable in the sense (0+ / 0-)

        that one feels with public displays of affection, or is it something else?

        Be excellent to each other.-Bill and Ted
        Dispassionate Liberal

        by Mark Adams on Mon Jun 04, 2007 at 07:53:29 PM PDT

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        •  I don't have any problem with (12+ / 0-)

          public displays of affection ( as long as it isn't 'sex while clothed').
          I just wasn't taught that "praise Jesus" was the right way to end sentences.

          Something in my memory about Jesus saying it is better to pray devoutly in your closet than to pound your chest and loudly proclaim how much you love God in public... something about humility and reverence, I think.

          "In the United States, political will is a renewable resource". Gore 2008

          by Lisa Lockwood on Mon Jun 04, 2007 at 07:57:07 PM PDT

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          •  Jesus condemned hypocrisy and "piety for show" (3+ / 0-)
            Recommended by:
            nancelot, Lisa Lockwood, fayeforcure

            a lot more often than he said anything about gay sex, gay marriage, or abortion.

            Politics is like driving. To go backward, put it in R. To go forward, put it in D.
            IMPEACH CHENEY FIRST.

            by TrueBlueMajority on Mon Jun 04, 2007 at 09:24:11 PM PDT

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          •  How dare you take Christ at His word! (2+ / 0-)
            Recommended by:
            Lisa Lockwood, fayeforcure

            I suppose you also think those who pray in public and talk about their faith already have their reward too. You probably think that those who put on and take off their faith as if it were just another fashion accessory are just like the Pharisees. You probably don't understand that faith is just another one of the social graces and a measure of how we are perceived by society. One must learn to display the appropriate amount of faith according to the social venue. You probably also think that charity, kindness, compassion, and good works are more important than faith. Silly you. All of the virtues are overrated. Only our faith matters.

          •  Seeing the actions of (2+ / 0-)
            Recommended by:
            Lisa Lockwood, TomP

            I recall learning that to avoid pride,  we were to pray in the silence of our rooms.

            I've witnessed, in the virtual public square, the faith of Jesus being come to be be known as pro-rich, pro-war and I say to myself, "Something's happening here...and it isn't what I was taught as a Christian. Jesus was on the side of peace. He told us to help the poor."

            When strident voices claim to represent Christians when they don't speak for most of us, it's time to take back what is best about our faith in the public square.

            Rev Wallis said it this way: The Bible reveals a very public God. God is personal, but never private.

            Republicans who've wanted to control the values debate don't want to discusss faith too deeply because in so many ways, faith revolves around the common good...and when we talk about the common public good, we Democrats are accused of inciting class warfare.

            I believe we should not be hesitant to speak publically in order to define the terms of the national values debate and not leave it up to those who would water it down to what is politically convenient for not-so-Christian purposes [war, greed, intolerance etc].

            Immigration is one issue where talking about out faith can make a difference.
            One example can be seen here at my blog.

      •  He practices this all the time. (12+ / 0-)

        He has been in the trenches with union picketers, got six minimum wage initiatives passed in 2006, organized projects to deliver relief to New Orleans, traveled around the world to work to fight poverty, and sent 100 students to college in NC.

        There is nothing wrong with proclaiming one's faith as long as one acts on it. I don't have a problem with either Edwards or Obama doing what they are doing since they both act on their convictions.

      •  One would be excused, (1+ / 0-)
        Recommended by:
        Lisa Lockwood

        amongst their proclamations of faith that they were running for some other office besides President. As one who is a very commited secularist I am uncomfterable with anything that blurs what needs to be and should be a very rigid seperation of church and state. I really don't care what their religous beleifs are and I really don't care to hear them. I found this whole interogatory confessional a disturbing waste of perfectly good oxygen. The banner "Faith, guiding our vote" was particularly obnoxious. Faith doesn't, never has and never will guide my vote. Knowledge does.

        it tastes like burning...

        by eastvan on Mon Jun 04, 2007 at 09:19:41 PM PDT

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        •  Faith and knowledge are not mutually exclusive (1+ / 0-)
          Recommended by:
          Lisa Lockwood

          I thought you might appreciate this one example:

          From a recent interview with a Jesuit astronomer (LeMoyne College magazine):

          Q: Do you think there is hope that we can reconcile this perceived divide between science and religion?

          A: There is hope; there’s always hope. And some of it comes from education. Although education is not the solution to everything, everything depends on education. Some of it will just come from people growing up and being more used to the idea. There has been a generational divide. I think scientists of the generation ahead of me were much more reluctant to talk about their religious beliefs in public. That’s not true anymore, certainly not in astronomy and physics. And there’s no longer the sense that if you’re a religious person you’re somehow less of a scientist. You still see that in the older scientists... but you don’t see it in the young people coming up anymore. And that culture has changed in the sciences. I don’t see any reason why that culture couldn’t change in religion as well.

          Q: Will there always be new scientific discoveries?

          A: I hope so. My father had a wonderful thing he taught me as a kid: Knowledge is like a circle. The more you know, the bigger the circle. But the circumference of the circle is the things that you know you don’t know. And the bigger the circle gets, the bigger the circumference gets. So the more you know, the more you realize there’s still to be learned. And if you think you know everything, it means you know nothing.

          •  Well said, but (0+ / 0-)

            (if I may)

            Knowledge is like a circle. The more you know, the bigger the circle. But the circumference of the circle is the things that you know you don’t know. And the bigger the circle gets, the bigger the circumference gets. So the more you know, the more you realize there’s still to be learned. And if you think you know everything, it means you know nothing.

            This confirms it! Rummy had a Jesuit education!

            "Reports that say that something hasn't happened are always interesting to me, because as we know, there are known knowns; there are things we know we know. We also know there are known unknowns; that is to say we know there are some things we do not know. But there are also unknown unknowns -- the ones we don't know we don't know."

            "In the United States, political will is a renewable resource". Gore 2008

            by Lisa Lockwood on Tue Jun 05, 2007 at 03:55:44 AM PDT

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    •  brains with out (4+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      Iddybud, nancelot, djtyg, TomP

      moral compass are hallow. Who among us does not try to equate a love of what is good about both humanity and  nature with our viewpoint of politics. The soul is needed, as much as I am a democrat I'm a human first, to view the world with out the ability to see beyond the material is fatal, as religion is a need a force for something beyond the concept of winning, as a total secular person my rationality is tempered by humans search in a truth then win or kill. With out spirit we have nothing.

      "And if my thought-dreams could be seen They'd probably put my head in a guillotine" Bob Dylan

      by shaharazade on Mon Jun 04, 2007 at 08:17:57 PM PDT

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      •  Reminds me of Grace by U2 (2+ / 0-)
        Recommended by:
        4Freedom, TomP

        Grace
        It's a name for a girl
        It's also a thought that changed the world
        And when she walks on the street
        You can hear the strings
        Grace finds goodness in everything

        What once was hurt
        What once was friction
        What left a mark
        No longer stings
        Because grace makes beauty
        Out of ugly things

    •  Same with me---brains over prayers--- (1+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      blueintheface

      I don't want bush's god talking to any more politicians, telling them to go to war and bomb people and places for no good reason

    •  But to pray with intent, (2+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      TrueBlueMajority, djtyg

      you have to use your brain.

      -4.00, -5.33 In certified results, DovBear has won 3 JIBS in categories he actually belonged in.

      by 4jkb4ia on Mon Jun 04, 2007 at 08:38:34 PM PDT

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    •  I was annoyed about the religious proclamations (1+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      dc 20005

      made by all the candidates, and I wrote Paula Zahn to never ever talk about the "culture war" issues of abortion and gay marriage ever again.

      They are the Rethugs talking points and we shouldn't be forced to engage in them.

      We have far more important issues to deal with:

      1. Ending the Iraq war NOW
      1. Providing Universal Healcare to all NOW

      Edwards puts healthcare reform on the table in a very credible way and is tough enough to make HR 676,....the ultimate goal, achievable.

      by fayeforcure on Mon Jun 04, 2007 at 09:22:01 PM PDT

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    •  You know, the two aren't mutually exclusive (1+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      ecclesioleft

      One can have great intelligence and political judgement and, at the same time, be a person of deep faith. But I can hardly believe I'm having to say this.

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