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View Diary: Pentagon Pushes Apocalyptic Christianity. Hard. (275 comments)

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  •  Great diary, but (14+ / 0-)

    I'm not sure about this:

    ...the only way to combat the spread of fundamentalist and apocalyptic strains of Christian belief within the most powerful armed forces on the planet would be for Americans with different sorts of beliefs to form their own "ministries", targeting armed forces members in the same manner, to promote moderate Christian beliefs, respect for church-state separation, pluralistic democratic values, and so on.

    To me, it brings up images of 'saved' people selling butterflies and plastic poppies while soldiers are going about their business.  The military personnel have long been targets of such 'missionary' ventures that prey on the lonely and cut-off enlisteds.  

    (In Dover, we were harassed by some door-to-door freaks until my boyfriend answered the door in his underwear -- they never came back.)

    It has always been my assumption that any chaplain should not have an agenda.  In other words, a christian soldier could talk to a rabbi about god and get spiritual guidance without feeling pressured to convert.

    I don't think that the military should be a place for discussions about particular religious beliefs whether moderate or extreme.  Spiritual guidance is one thing but religious doctrine should be left out.

    Investigate! Impeach! Indict! Incarcerate!

    by Cato come back on Sun Sep 02, 2007 at 10:29:05 AM PDT

    [ Parent ]

    •  Well, my point is this : (6+ / 0-)

      Even if we don't like their religious views, much of what groups such as the Officer's Christian Fellowship do is quite legitimate. Constitutional, that is.

      So, how can the spread of such ideas possibly be countered when the methods ( most of them, anyway ) are legitimate ?

      Basically, there's no "market" competition, no competing ideologies.

      •  Good point, no doubt. (4+ / 0-)
        Recommended by:
        Troutfishing, praedor, ocdiamond, kyril

        I just think that religions should keep their dogma in the churches and keep the gods out of military planning.

        There are moral, ethical, and philosophical imperatives that rely on our responsibility towards each other.  I'm guessing that any god would be happy if we followed those imperatives -- whether in his/her name or not.

        For example:  A soldier's conscience may think it is wrong to murder civilians.  But his/her church preaches a 'higher purpose' that demands winning (for god) at any cost.  The soldier's conscience should be free of the pressure to act immorally for god -- but rather to follow human law enacted by a civil society.

        But, to further your point, it seems that there are groups that are 'cornering the market' on god and there may be no way to counter them unless it is to beat them at their own economic 'god' game.

        Investigate! Impeach! Indict! Incarcerate!

        by Cato come back on Sun Sep 02, 2007 at 12:04:44 PM PDT

        [ Parent ]

    •  Laser Printer and Cat Food . . . (10+ / 0-)

      The local Seventh Day Adventists used to wake us up Saturday mornings wanting to give us pamphlets, and come in and talk.

      Every goddamned Saturday.

      Until I fired up the laser printer one Friday night, found the can opener, and was ready for 'em Saturday morning.

      I opened 2 small cans of cat food (one chicken liver, one ocean fish), and when I saw them come walking up our street, ringing doorbells, I tossed it in a dry frying pan on high heat.

      Two minutes later, the smell of burning flesh filled the house as I answered the door in a black silk bathrobe, mirrored sunglasses, unlaced combat boots, meat cleaver in one hand, and a printed up recipe for roasted child in the other -- which I handed to them before saying a word.

      They asked if I'd heard the Good News, I said look, it's the annual Feast of Mordor today, and I have to cook a child for tonight's Witches Sabbath. I said come back after dark, when I'm all done cooking. I'll introduce you to the real Lord of Creation. He'll give you presents.

      That was four months ago.

      I think they took us off their list.

      "The rule of the wise must be absolute . . . rulers ought not to be responsible to the unwise subjects." ~ Professor Leo Strauss

      by antifa on Sun Sep 02, 2007 at 12:34:53 PM PDT

      [ Parent ]

    •  I have an aquaintance who, when spotting (2+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      Cato come back, ocdiamond

      Fundies approaching his door, answers in his altogether! They do NOT return!!  Must not be a pretty sight, IMHO!!

      Aloha .. .. ..

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