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View Diary: Kids sodomized at Abu Ghraib, Pentagon has the videos - Hersh (430 comments)

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  •  Let's see ... I don't agree with you (4.00)
    imagine we had a porn movie showing the sodomization of young boys (children) and someone would dare to complain and ask to prohibit the broadcasting of such material.

    I am sure we would hear a lot of voices defending the values of freedom of speech and with it the request to allow the broadcast of such material via internet or CDs etc.

    We don't want to be the bad guys, who limit the freedom of expression, it's none of our business what people see in their privacy of their homes and get a kick out, right?

    Now we have the same acts on video (just taken under different circumstances, but who cares) and we know for a fact the people who recorded  those acts on video did get a good kick out of it, feeling all powerful and dandy to be in a situation where they had some "good justification, legalized by the authorities" to produce some "killer porn" video.

    For sure we will hear a lot of voices defending the decency and values of the American people and with it the prohibition to broadcast those videos, showing the same thing as the porn videos, whose broadcast they all would protect in a heartbeat, as long as they were made for financial profit and not for political reasons.

    The fact that this material doesn't leak out and the TV media are such corporate coward entitites, who whorishly "sanitize" their broadcasts from all truthfulness to not embarrass the public moral conscience, is the true shame in all of it.

    I am all for limiting porn broadcasts for profit. I am certainly NOT for SURPRESSING and LIMITING the broadcast of real sexual abuses, that were recorded for whatever disgusting purposes, if they represent the truthful violence of sexual abuses that actually occured.

    How more rotten can your moral and ethical conscience become?

    "History is cluttered with the wreckage of nations and individuals that pursued the self-defeating path of hate." - Martin Luther King

    by mimi on Wed Jul 14, 2004 at 08:39:30 PM PDT

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    •  Pretty rotten, I guess. (2.50)
      But it's not really MY conscience I was referring to, but to the average American's conscience.  They just don't give a tin shit.  If they did, Bush would've been impeached or would've falled victim to a Tuilleries-style revolution by incensed mobs.

      I'm merely talking the political realities.  The very first poster of this thread said, "The story is over", and as far as I can tell, he's correct.  High-minded moral self-righteousness won't change the fact.

      But if the sound of screaming Iraqi children suddenly changes everybody's minds in this country, I'll be sure to eat some humble pie on this website.  Until then, I'll take my rotten conscience with Kerry and Edwards -- each of whom have treaded as gingerly on this subject as mice in a room full of rat-traps -- to victory.

      "The thicker the hay, the more easily it is mowed."--Alaric, Gothic chief, outside the gates of Rome, 408 A.D.

      by Romulus Augustulus on Wed Jul 14, 2004 at 08:55:04 PM PDT

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      •  You have spun yourself (none)
        beyond making sense in this and the previous post.  Of course K/E will nto be furthering this.  
        It is for the media and congress and the various NGO in theatre, the UN and UNICEF.  I am sorry, you are naive and poorly informed.

        To be frank you wish to sound as though you are adult, but I wonder, you sound younger and younger. Certainly young politically.

        I am leaving side conversation now, nothing to be gained here in this back and forth.

        I guess we have Gen. Boykin Rules of Engagement: our god is bigger.

        by Marisacat on Wed Jul 14, 2004 at 09:04:59 PM PDT

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      •  Your mouth should already be full of humble pie (4.00)
        The revelation of Abu Ghraib resulted in a big dip in Bush's ratings.  Your claims about "the average American" are both ignorant and full of ridiculous hyperbole -- revelation of Abu Ghraib had an effect, but not so extreme as impeachment, and French-style revolution would be an extreme over-reaction.  The moderate effect of the revelation is largely due to the fact that Bush, with the help of the SCLM, spun it as "bad apples" -- his direct policy responsbility is unknown to the average American (who doesn't read this blog) due to the machinations  of the propaganda machine.  Even so, Bush took a big hit.  And revelation of sodomized children would result in a bigger hit, and a better chance of bringing the war criminals, all of them, to justice (and that is why we want to "get Bush" -- because he's guilty of crimes against humanity).

        I know it's a tough thing to accept, but the reason so many people here disagree with you is because you're wrong.  Your facts, your reasoning, your claims about motives, and your moral tone -- or lack of it.

      •  I agree with you here -not for the same reasons (none)

        If this story "is over" then because there are no video clips and images broadcasted all over the place showing the abuse has occurred the way it was verbally already stated.

        The only and real question to ask is: "Where are the video clips and images that prove the extent of the abuse?"

        If they don't exist, we shouldn't make a big story without having proof. If they do exist, we need to know, who hides them and why. Then we have to decide to kick people out of office or bring the to court, who support hiding the proofs of a crime. That all has nothing to do with "party politics", IMO.

        "History is cluttered with the wreckage of nations and individuals that pursued the self-defeating path of hate." - Martin Luther King

        by mimi on Thu Jul 15, 2004 at 06:27:41 AM PDT

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