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View Diary: Bush Authoritarianism: Blackwater+Amway=GOP, Pt. 2 (295 comments)

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  •  You apparently still don't understand the concept (2+ / 0-)
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    Inky, vets74

    of merger of private and governmental interests.  If the private sector takes over the government and implements a program that otherwise looks like fascism, is it not fascism because the private sector is calling the shots, and does so with the power of the state apparatus which is has captured?  Ridiculous.

    Beyond that, whether there has been a "fascist state" or not is irrelevant to the question of whether fascist ideology exists (and thrives.)  Prior to the October Revolution in Russia, there had never been a socialist/communist state.  By your reckoning, in 1916 you could squelch any discussion of communist ideology by asking "show me a communist state!"  We're not talking about instantiation of ideology here, we're talking about ideology itself.

    Talking about instantiations of ideology invites quibbling.  If I bring up Paraguay under Stroessner, you can say "oh, but the security apparatus didn't reach all the way into the hinterlands" or some such twaddle.  That doesn't really matter.  What matters in a discussion of whether an ideological epithet or appellation is appropriation is the ideology itself: what are the goals, what is the philosophy, of the one accused?

    Don't be so far above politics that you can't help clear the snakes down on the ground. (P.S.: my opinions are mine, not my employer's.)

    by Major Danby on Mon Oct 15, 2007 at 12:03:02 PM PDT

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    •  Mussolini made no such claim. (1+ / 0-)
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      Major Danby

      He and his brother-in-law defined fascism and he founded the first fascist party.

      Saying that "the State" has to act in and of itself, without private impulse, makes little sense.

      That would require a political movement similar to Lenin and the Bolsheviks. Or Mao and his inner clique.

      Fascism has never worked like this. Even with Hitler.

      Fascism has combined power holders with private interest groups everywhere, every time out.

      Dixie Chicks and Amy Winehouse. Imus and Lenny Bruce. Overcome evil with good.

      by vets74 on Mon Oct 15, 2007 at 01:30:21 PM PDT

      [ Parent ]

      •  I think that you mean to address that to DH (0+ / 0-)

        You may want to repost it as a reply to one of his comments so that he sees it.

        Don't be so far above politics that you can't help clear the snakes down on the ground. (P.S.: my opinions are mine, not my employer's.)

        by Major Danby on Mon Oct 15, 2007 at 01:32:07 PM PDT

        [ Parent ]

        •  As a guess, DH's mind is made up. (2+ / 0-)
          Recommended by:
          Inky, Major Danby

          He caught hold of a distinction -- The State as core of everythng -- and ain'tgonna give it up.

          Copying a favorite pit bull.

          BTW: Wiki on fascism.

          "Anti-individualistic, the fascist conception of life stresses the importance of the State and accepts the individual only insofar as his interests coincide with those of the State, which stands for the conscience and the universal will of man as a historic entity.... The fascist conception of the State is all-embracing; outside of it no human or spiritual values can exist, much less have value.... Fascism is therefore opposed to that form of democracy which equates a nation to the majority, lowering it to the level of the largest number.... We are free to believe that this is the century of authority, a century tending to the 'right', a Fascist century. If the nineteenth century was the century of the individual (liberalism implies individualism) we are free to believe that this is the 'collective' century, and therefore the century of the State."

          Mussolini.

          Sounds like the play list guy at Clear Channel. They'll tell us what to think, you betcha....

          Dixie Chicks and Amy Winehouse. Imus and Lenny Bruce. Overcome evil with good.

          by vets74 on Mon Oct 15, 2007 at 02:37:05 PM PDT

          [ Parent ]

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